DIY Home Improvement, Remodeling & Repair Forum > DIY Home Improvement > Windows and Doors > Removing Moisture from double pane windows




Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-27-2011, 08:36 PM  
liderbug
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Black Forest, CO
Posts: 13
Default

Sorry about that - $15 10cf tank - party store - I sealed the window first then using a couple of ink needles (wife's ink jet refill kit) - stood the window up - one in the bottom, one in the top connected to the tank through the SS. Very low valve open - very light sssssssss for about 5 min. I could see the window bow () just a little bit. I put a lot of work into them didn't want to hear - POP! After the 5 min. I turned the gas off and removed the needles and with a toothpick worked silicone into the hole - then did the silicone seal on all four sides. Oh, and by the time the second needle was removed the pressure was zero. Like I said the Helium was left over from.... [I forget]. I just figured there was less DMHO in the tank than in the room air.

4/28 17:00 #10 is done. The project is over (well I've got some cleanup to do etc). I figure at 2 hrs per window I just got paid $25/hr for my labor +/-.



__________________

Last edited by liderbug; 04-29-2011 at 07:31 AM. Reason: update
liderbug is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-10-2011, 07:29 PM  
liderbug
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Black Forest, CO
Posts: 13
Default Next project

Well the above works - unless the glass is etched. Seems the kitchen slider (4x6) fogging was 10% fog, 90% etch. Wonder what's in the air.



__________________
liderbug is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-02-2011, 01:40 PM  
daveswife2005
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1
Default Removing Moisture from Fogged Dbl Pane Windows

Looking for company in Atlanta GA area to fix fogged thermal pane windows. Want them fixed, not replaced. Please contact Cheryl at 770-479-7050 asap. Posted 6/2/2011.

Quote:
Originally Posted by torontomix View Post
There is a local company that will remove my moisture by drilling two holes in the window (opposite ends) then spray a chemical that basically eats the moisture from inside the window and plug up again.

I’ve drilled glass before and I know how easy it is with the right tools (diamond drill bits etc etc)

My question is if anyone knows what this chemical is called? If they ever done anything like this before and any bumps they might have hit

Thanks guys
Dan
__________________
daveswife2005 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-24-2011, 12:37 PM  
norris
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1
Default Super spacer questions

Hello liderbug,

Thanks for sharing information about your project! I'm wanting to do much the same thing (except creating new double pane units instead of fixing an old one). I have a few questions about your process.

The ebay source for super spacers (thanks for that pointer; it's been really hard finding anyone local who will sell us spacers!) seems to only sell the Super Spacer T-spacer, which is described at Edgetech's manufacturer website. You said you found your spacers locally--did you get the T-spacers, or another type?

-How did you seal the corner? The manufacturer website for the T-spacers says you need to seal the corner with "PIB backed strips" to prevent loss of gas and moisture infiltration.

-Did you only use silicone sealant? The website indicates that you need to use butyl rubber as the primary seal, then silicone as the secondary structural seal.

Thanks again!

Norris Thomlinson
Portland, OR

__________________
norris is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-13-2011, 08:42 AM  
VentsnotValves
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 3
Default

Helium? That's a new one to me. The He molecule is very small, aren't you concerned that it will find some way out sooner more than later? I would be interested in hearing of how this fix lasts. Hopefully, you sealing the contours, helped. I guess the question is are you sure that the ingress of moisture was stopped?

Lucky when you pushed gas in there, they didn't pop, very dangerous move. That's why the repair guys use liquids that absorb moisture and evaporate it. (preferably those that don't leave a residue that is noticable.)

IGU (insulated glass unit) replacements is big business. It will always be around, and should not feel threatened by the small guys trying to save windows. IGU manufactures all have slightly different methods of make their products. It does not need to be true that all manufactures fill the space with a gas that benefits the life and quality. Nor is it always true that they vacuum the space long enough to get all the moisture out of that “adiabatic” space. (Dead space, when heat does not enter or leave. New Oxford American Dictionary.)

Does the technique of venting work? Yes it works. Up to the point were the incoming moisture is less than that which can be vented. In short, if what you have is a fish tank and not a window it may not work. Also, I have seen many mentions of the calcification (which is a form of glass surface deterioration often due to a reaction of trapped moisture reacting with the sealant (sulfur compounds and various etchants), metal spacer, and the iron in the glass. The high temperature and multiple cycles will cause deposits to crystalize and etch with the glass).

Please keep in mind, that many start in the repair business hoping to make a good business and honest living. However, most times the larger name group is the one that takes the bulk of the profits.

There are still good honest repair persons out there. You should look for track records! Most that are still in the condensation removal business use it only as a complement to their replacement business.

They use “Vents not Valves” and if they fix it correctly the IGU will out last any new replacements. Which if you think about it, a new IGU is just like pressing a reset button for the next 5 + years. But if you fix it correctly your done for many years.

I will be fair to say we manufacture all sorts of small products and simple tools. Some which are used in this industry. We do not repair IGU’s

Good luck
Questions are welcome

__________________
VentsnotValves is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-07-2011, 11:51 AM  
GTVic
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VentsnotValves View Post
Good luck
Questions are welcome
The consensus seems to be that fogged windows are a cosmetic issue. Similarly, the felt seals that eventually dry up and allow drafts are not really a risk to the building. Is that correct?

Where this affects a condominium is the cost. The cost to all the owners of replacing fogged windows or the felt seals ($100 / window) is quite high. I am trying to find out if it is justified to pass this cost on to the individual affected owners or actually to get them to arrange and pay for the repairs themselves.
__________________
GTVic is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-08-2011, 05:16 PM  
VentsnotValves
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 3
Default

"Felt seals", are you talking about slider windows? Felts on slider windows are not my expertise, but sliders can fog up even more if the seal is good. This is all about due point, differential temperatures, and inside humidity.
Cosmetic? not sure what do you mean?
Window manufacturers do not add felts for the simple cosmetics. They do serve a purpose of keeping the outside elements from entering the space between the inside sliders (thats if there are two sets of sliders).

A good window installer should be able to recondition the felts and seals on even slider windows for a fraction of the cost of replacement. I think if was my window I would up-keep as much as possible. Moisture and mold is hardly cosmetic.

As for who pays? That's not for me to say. Are windows part of the building?

Not sure if I answered the question?

__________________
VentsnotValves is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-09-2011, 01:51 AM  
GTVic
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 2
Default

Sorry, by felt seals I was referring to weather stripping on the parts of the windows that open. These are grey strips that slide in the grooves in the aluminum frames. Similar to the grey strips on sliding doors. We were quoted $100 per window to replace all of these.

I didn't mean to link felt seals and "cosmetic", two separate issues. I have been advised that according to our strata act, fogging windows are replaced at the expense of the strata corporation, while the upkeep of the weather stripping, rollers for sliding doors, handles, cranks and screens can be assigned to the individual condominium owners via a strata corporation bylaw.

By cosmetic I meant is it possible that a fogging window pane can be left alone if there are no other issues with the window? The insulation value of the window is not compromised greatly and if there is nothing wrong with the frame or around the frame then there is no reason to replace it except to improve the appearance. That is what I am understanding by reading through some of the comments here.

Now I have one of our owners complaining that all the drafts she is feeling in winter cannot possibly be due to those little grey strips getting old and that we should be investigating a complete window replacement project, frames and all I'm guessing. With all the stucco on the outside, I'm guessing that replacing 200 aluminum double-pane windows and 70 sliding doors is a very expensive proposition and according to the "expert" who looked at the windows, completely unnecessary.

__________________
GTVic is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-10-2011, 06:18 AM  
VentsnotValves
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTVic View Post
Sorry, by felt seals I was referring to weather stripping on the parts of the windows that open. These are grey strips that slide in the grooves in the aluminum frames. Similar to the grey strips on sliding doors. We were quoted $100 per window to replace all of these.

reply: As for the high quote. Was this a written quote? Did you ask for an explanation from the contractor. Does he need to rent special tools for the job ... sky jack etc. maybe has to work from the outside etc. I find $ 100 per window quite high. I would get more quotes to change those felts.

I didn't mean to link felt seals and "cosmetic", two separate issues. I have been advised that according to our strata act, fogging windows are replaced at the expense of the strata corporation, while the upkeep of the weather stripping, rollers for sliding doors, handles, cranks and screens can be assigned to the individual condominium owners via a strata corporation bylaw.

By cosmetic I meant is it possible that a fogging window pane can be left alone if there are no other issues with the window? The insulation value of the window is not compromised greatly and if there is nothing wrong with the frame or around the frame then there is no reason to replace it except to improve the appearance. That is what I am understanding by reading through some of the comments here.

Reply for both paragraphs: constant fogging windows will and can degrade the actual glass (as in IGU's). It is a long term effect that moisture has while reacting with low grades of glass and glues, rubbers (mostly sulfur based compounds) that are close to the glass and moisture. This is not reversible will damage the glass for good. The bad strips may be compounding the effects and assisting in the dew point thereby part of the fogging.

Now I have one of our owners complaining that all the drafts she is feeling in winter cannot possibly be due to those little grey strips getting old and that we should be investigating a complete window replacement project, frames and all I'm guessing. With all the stucco on the outside, I'm guessing that replacing 200 aluminum double-pane windows and 70 sliding doors is a very expensive proposition and according to the "expert" who looked at the windows, completely unnecessary.
Reply: How old is the caulking around the doors and windows?

It is hard to measure quantity of draft. Air flow on its own is a science (fluid dynamics). There is too much to discuss here. A simple test is visual, using 3 continual squares of toilet paper taped over a cloths hanger. You get close to your suspected area and watch what the tissue does. The paper will move to reveal a draft.
As for a repair versus change out. It would be difficult for anyone to claim to be of help at a distance without inspecting. Get at least 3 separate written quotes keep good records. Take good pictures, date them, and store them for future discussions and complaints... Sometimes even an expert will charge you a displacement fee to assess your problems (some will even credit this fee towards their bill) but it well worth the satisfaction to show what 3 separate pros see that owners and managers don't.

Hope this helps
good luck
__________________
VentsnotValves is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-23-2011, 06:00 PM  
tonyc56
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1
Default Removing Moisture from double pane windows

Has anyone used The Glass Guru for window moisture removal. If so, did their process work....



__________________
tonyc56 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter DIY Home Repair Forum Replies Last Post
replacement windows and your health John7447 General Home Improvement Discussion 4 04-29-2010 11:29 PM
what do I do with my old storm windows John7447 General Home Improvement Discussion 2 06-29-2009 10:38 AM
Double pane window condensation jay11235 HVAC 0 12-19-2008 12:34 PM
Removing Windows tallula Windows and Doors 2 07-07-2006 08:33 PM
Windows jroach6346 Windows and Doors 6 11-29-2005 12:55 PM