DIY Home Improvement, Remodeling & Repair Forum > DIY Home Improvement > Bricks, Masonry and Concrete > Patch/seal a concrete seam in cold weather - how to?




Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-17-2007, 11:03 AM  
Quattro
Massive Tool Belt
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 262
Default Patch/seal a concrete seam in cold weather - how to?

Hi all, I need some help repairing a joint under the top step of the front entryway to my house. The top slab is actually over the corner of the basement, which is odd, but that's another topic.

The issue is this joint between old and new concrete, as seen in the photo below:



The previous homeowner is a mason, and did a lot of concrete and brick work around and inside the house. In 1999, he repaired/resurfaced the entry steps. The concrete under the "lip" is actually the top of the foundation. The concrete in the foreground is the second step. The concrete on top is the top step.

It doesn't look like it from this picture, but cold winter air is entering the basement through this crack/joint. This basically runs the entire perimeter of the top step...and I know this is happening because I'm getting frost in the basement directly on the other side of this concrete.

I need to patch this, asap. Any ideas what will work in the sub-freezing weather? I'll consider anything that is close color-wise...so if something elastomeric or asphaultic comes in "gray", it should work. I just need to stop the air coming in, then I can insulate from the basement side.

Your thoughts are welcome. Thank you.



__________________
Quattro is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-17-2007, 04:44 PM  
glennjanie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,990
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Send a message via AIM to glennjanie
Default

I would use Silicone caulk and use the 'pressure caulk' method. Folks generally drag the nozzle along as they pump the caulk out; to pressure caulk the nozzle should be pushed along at a 45* angle watching to see the caulk come up in front of the nozzle just slightly as you move along. The joint can be tooled after it is applied.
Merry Christmas
Glenn



__________________
glennjanie is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-17-2007, 05:30 PM  
ToolGuy
Senior Member
 
ToolGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 482
Default

Polyurethane caulk will cure better in the cold climate, where as silicone might not cure and just remain sticky forever.

I use that pressure caulking method a lot and definately the right way to do it. But I've always called it pushing the caulk.

__________________

[COLOR="DarkRed"][B]~ ToolGuy ~[/B][/COLOR]

[I]Save money on tools at [URL="http://mytoolbox.net"]MyToolbox.net[/URL]
[/I]

ToolGuy is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2007, 10:28 AM  
Quattro
Massive Tool Belt
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 262
Default

Thanks! I'll give it a shot. Then, when it warms up a bit (April, maybe?), I'll do some sort of skim-coat over the whole thing with a concrete-refinisher.

__________________
Quattro is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2007, 01:02 PM  
ToolGuy
Senior Member
 
ToolGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 482
Default

Glad we could be of help, Quattro.

About skimming the whole thing, the crack will come right back through. The new concrete did not bond to the old concrete, which is why it separated and air is coming through. The old and new concrete are moving relative to eachother and there's nothing that can be done about it.

__________________

[COLOR="DarkRed"][B]~ ToolGuy ~[/B][/COLOR]

[I]Save money on tools at [URL="http://mytoolbox.net"]MyToolbox.net[/URL]
[/I]

ToolGuy is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-19-2007, 07:32 AM  
Quattro
Massive Tool Belt
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 262
Default

Hmm, nothing seems to be moving, the guy just didn't do a very good job on the seam. I've heard some "injectable" epoxy may help keep the seam together...which I may try in the spring.

For now, I'm going to tackle the problem from the inside (basement). I'll squirt expanding foam between the top of the foundation and the plywood form that the stoop slab is resting on. Then, I'll use 2" XPS to block off that entire area to help keep the relatively warm basement air from colliding with whatever air might still be coming through the seam.

I'll update.

__________________
Quattro is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-19-2007, 08:32 AM  
ToolGuy
Senior Member
 
ToolGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 482
Default

The foams are sure to make a big difference, probably solve the problem altogether. I'd like to know how that turns out.

__________________

[COLOR="DarkRed"][B]~ ToolGuy ~[/B][/COLOR]

[I]Save money on tools at [URL="http://mytoolbox.net"]MyToolbox.net[/URL]
[/I]

ToolGuy is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-03-2008, 12:55 PM  
Quattro
Massive Tool Belt
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 262
Default

Well, I took the first step and applied Great Stuff in the space between the top of the foundation and the treated plywood form that is under that slab. At first it looked like it stopped most of the air intrusion, but we just got another really cold shot of air, and now there is frost forming around the great stuff, and down the concrete wall in the basement. So...still some work to do. I assume the wood form is just getting cold enough to condense the basement air.

So I've got this 2" thick XPS. Should I put this up first, or a vapor barrier first? Do I even need a vapor barrier with this stuff? Eventually it will be sheetrocked, so I need to be sure the basement air moisture doesn't reach the wood form. I don't want to just cover everything in foam, and have the problem persist behind the foam where I can't see it.

I'll take a picture when I get home tonight and post it here.

Thanks!

__________________
Quattro is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-03-2008, 04:16 PM  
ToolGuy
Senior Member
 
ToolGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 482
Default

XPS first, then vapor barrier. Vapor barrier should always be toward the interior, and any insulation toward the exterior, lest the vapor barrier itself will get cold and collect condensation like a cold window pane.

__________________

[COLOR="DarkRed"][B]~ ToolGuy ~[/B][/COLOR]

[I]Save money on tools at [URL="http://mytoolbox.net"]MyToolbox.net[/URL]
[/I]

ToolGuy is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-03-2008, 07:37 PM  
Quattro
Massive Tool Belt
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 262
Default

OK, that's what I thought. Thanks!

Now, on to the pics. These are taken in the basement, looking up at the underside of that top step. You can see the steel "lintels" used to rest the treated plywood form on. The framing is very "iffy" if you ask me. I'm contemplating removing that framing and putting a load-bearing wall under the lengthwise lintel instead. Thoughts? The house is 20 years old and there doesn't seem to be any issues with the way it is built now, other than the obvious air intrusion (which the Great Stuff didn't seem to stop).



and another view:



I'm thinking more about just framing up a wall that would support the inside edge of that slab. Then I could take out all the iffy framing and build a regular ceiling with the XPS, plastic, and drywall. I could use that space as an equipment closet or something.

Your thoughts?

Thanks!



__________________
Quattro is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter DIY Home Repair Forum Replies Last Post
Very cold weather noise Bwildly Roofing and Siding 2 01-16-2009 03:16 PM
Patch Foundation Holes in Cold Weather martimartin Bricks, Masonry and Concrete 5 11-29-2008 02:56 PM
Concrete porch and steps rookiepb Bricks, Masonry and Concrete 4 11-07-2008 05:10 AM
Sealing Exposed Aggregate Cold Weather schnur07 Bricks, Masonry and Concrete 2 10-15-2008 04:23 PM
Best Homes For Cold Weather buddha2005 General Home Improvement Discussion 0 11-18-2005 10:39 AM