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Old 02-09-2010, 01:27 PM  
Quattro
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We've been very happy with our Kohler Forte. The single-hole pull-out with output selector (shower or stream) works great on our double Domsjo ceramic sink.



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Old 02-09-2010, 06:42 PM  
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Default picking a faucet?

I use to work retail in big box retail stores ex. Home Depot, lowes and Menards, also have friends that are plumbers. My advice is if you really want a Moen Single handle faucet go to a plumbing supply warehouse, the guts are primarily brass unlike the big box stores which are your 1225 silicone cartridges that I would sell dozens a week because within six months to a year would fail. The brass ones are far superior. The reason for big box stores having cheaper guts is that they want to bring in big names with cheap prices, moen hasnt made a good cheap single handle faucet. I just wouldnt buy one. Delta are more reliable for the money, and easy to fix. Price pfister also makes great faucets, they have porcelin cartridges that never wear out and if you have any problems they have gthe best guest service dept to help you out. If they dont have the part for your faucet I've seen them many times just ship you a brand new faucet similar to what you have



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Old 02-10-2010, 07:16 AM  
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Even though Nestor still can't seem to get it, I broke the porcelain piece which rendered the faucet worthless. This spurred the lovely Mrs to run out and buy a new faucet. She wasn't waiting for parts to show up. And the porcelain piece is the flow restrictor which can't be tampered with I found out.

I can teach my chocolate lab to remove the wafer in an aerator.

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Old 02-10-2010, 09:50 AM  
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I just phoned Moen at 1-800-321-6636 in the USA and 1-800-465-0279 in Canada to get my information straight from the horse's mouth and so people can confirm what I'm saying is correct.

1. Moen has not installed brass cartridges (the Moen 1200 cartridge) in their single lever faucets since 1987.

Sometimes it's easy to draw the wrong conclusion from your observations. My guess would be that the Moen faucets sold at the plumbing wholesaler that still had brass cartridges were simply older stock. It's not that Moen put brass cartridges in the faucets going to the wholesaler simply because they had a policy of providing better quality product to the plumbing wholesalers. Stores like Home Depot and Lowes have much higher sales than plumbing wholesalers, and so they'd normally be expected to carry newer stock.

2. Every Moen faucet is guaranteed for life against leaks and factory defects. So, if the faucet leaks, then just phone Moen (at the numbers above), give them the model number of your faucet, and they will send you a brand spanking new cartridge for it. That cartridge will come with instructions on how to replace the cartridge. However, officially that guarantee only applies to the original purchaser, but Moen isn't sticky about that, and they'll send out a new cartridge to anyone who needs one to fix their Moen faucet.

Moen also makes the 1225 cartridge available for sale because no one wants to do without their kitchen and bathroom sink faucets while they're waiting for the replacement to come in the mail. So, if Jimbo was selling dozens of 1225 cartridges a week, then I expect the reason was because the store was selling a hundred Moen single lever cartridges a week. Either that, or people would prefer to just pay the $10 for the replacement cartridge rather than wait a week for a replacement to come in the mail.

3. Moen is now changing their production to eliminate the 1225 cartridge. All new Moen single lever cartridges will now come with the Moen 1255 ceramic cartridge. The way to tell if the faucet has the new ceramic cartridge is by the supply lines attached to the faucet. If the supply lines are solid copper, it will have the 1225 cartridge. If they're braided stainless steel wire supply lines, they will have the new 1255 ceramic cartridge.


The new Moen 1255 "Duralast" ceramic disk cartridge will replace the 1225 cartridge.

Moen 1225 cartridges last a very long time, not six months to a year. If they only lasted six months to a year, then in a building like mine with 21 apartments and a total of 63 faucets (kitchen, bath sink and T&S), then one could reasonably expect to be replacing 63 to 106 cartridges a year, or about 7 or 8 per month. I don't do the same repair 7 or 8 times a year in my building on anything, let alone 7 or 8 times a month. Even a rubber washer will last many years. No plumber would have any respect for any faucet that had to be repaired every six months to a year. And, of course, if Moen faucet cartridges had to be replaced every 6 to 12 months, Moen sure wouldn't enjoy any brand loyalty. But, the fact that they're probably the most popular faucet on the continent means that either all of us are stupid, or that they make decent products that do stand up well.

Speedbump:
"Even though Nestor still can't seem to get it..."
What's with the attitude?
I figured I strive to "get it", so I phoned the sales agents for Moen. I phoned RNG Marketing at 1-877-280-6628 in Regina, Saskatchewan and talked to Justin Grohs who has represented Moen for over 10 years. During that time, he would have had dealings with plumbers, retailers and end customers regarding pretty well every product Moen has made. He told me that he has no personal knowledge of Moen ever using a porcelain anything inside the brass body of their faucets, and has never heard anyone make any reference to there being anything porcelain inside any Moen faucet. So, with respect, I think you're just making all this up. If you have the model number of the faucet, post it, and I will phone Moen personally to see if that model of faucet had a porcelain flow restrictor in the body of the faucet that would render the faucet useless if removed.

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Old 02-10-2010, 09:57 AM  
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Default Moen moving away from 1225 cartridge

Ilyaz:

Read Paragraph #3 of my previous post. Moen wouldn't be moving to the 1255 "Duralast" cartridge in all their single lever faucets unless they thought it was a better system. The new faucets with the ceramic Duralast 1255 cartridge will have the slogan "The faucet for life." associated with them.

You may want to hold off on buying your faucet until you get one with the new ceramic cartridge in it. You can tell by the supply hoses.

However, as with anything, it takes time to work any bugs out of new products. The other side of the coin is that any redesigned 1255 cartridges should be backward compatable with the original 1255's so that you can upgrade once/if the 1255 is redesigned to work out any bugs.

American Standard and I think it's Price Phister (?) have been making ceramic disk cartridges for years.
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Old 02-10-2010, 10:24 AM  
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Quote:
Speedbump:
"Even though Nestor still can't seem to get it..."
What's with the attitude?
I figured I strive to "get it", so I phoned the sales agents for Moen. I phoned RNG Marketing at 1-877-280-6628 in Regina, Saskatchewan and talked to Justin Grohs who has represented Moen for over 10 years. During that time, he would have had dealings with plumbers, retailers and end customers regarding pretty well every product Moen has made. He told me that he has no personal knowledge of Moen ever using a porcelain anything inside the brass body of their faucets, and has never heard anyone make any reference to there being anything porcelain inside any Moen faucet.
I apologize, I did say it was a Moen. To be totally honest with you I don't remember what brand the first faucet was. I know it was purchased from Barnett Brass, but it could have easily been any brand. It did have a porcelain mixer though cause I broke it. Until I go home and look tonight, I won't say whether I have a Moen in the kitchen or not. I just don't know for sure without looking.
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Old 02-10-2010, 02:44 PM  
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Oh my goodness...
As usual a simple topic with a simple discussion...

Gets made way more complex than could possibly be imagined by mere mortals...

I'll just stand on my original advice....

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Old 02-10-2010, 05:17 PM  
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Wheras if I were looking for a single lever kitchen faucet, I'd wait until I could get this:



with this:



inside it, and then buy.

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Old 02-10-2010, 11:35 PM  
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Nestor,
Ceramic cartridges are not the end all cure...
I replace quite a few...

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Old 02-11-2010, 08:45 AM  
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True, and I have no experience with them what-so-ever.

But, I presume that top management at Moen is of good intelligence and would have done their homework.

They would have looked at the operating principle of all the other ceramic disk cartridges on the market before even starting to design their own.

And, then they would have tested their design extensively before deciding to add it to their product line. They offer a lifetime warranty, so a glitch in the design that isn't revealed by testing can potentially cost them a lot of money.

And, they would have never made the decision to replace the 1225 cartridge with this new ceramic disk system unless their testing showed that it was clearly better.

For Moen to have done anything but that would have been incompetent management.

That logic is strong enough for me to put my money down on this new 1255 ceramic disk cartridge. Moen wouldn't make such a dramatic change to their product line unless they were confident in their decision to make that change, and that's good enough for me.

If they weren't 100% confident in their design, they would simply sit on the patent and keep testing. Delaying the introduction of this new cartidge won't cost them anything, but bringing it to market before fully testing the design could cost them a bundle in class action law suits.



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