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Old 06-09-2014, 02:34 PM  
Wuzzat?
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I'll parse your links for the 'message between the lines'. I can certainly use the practice.

You may also want to contact government oversight orgs but the one I went to said, in effect, 5000 people dying each year in the US unnecessarily is 'down in the noise.' AFAIK your group has not yet suffered casualties.

Supposedly almost no one can stand The Truth, but you guys are about to be confronted with it.
It's the truth about your state and federal governments and your fellow citizens.
And it's not like you asked for this revelation. It is being thrust upon you.

So far,
$500K for a bridge.
"For HS25 Designs: Inventory Rating = 45 tons and Operating Rating = 75 tons."
That's quite a bridge.

Why this bridge? Why not "panel bridges; pedestrian bridges, including modular or fixed length trusses; vehicle or pedestrian beam bridges; fixed modular bridges; vertical lift, bascule, retractable, or swing movable bridges; pipe bridges"

14' wide by 140' long by let's say 10' high = 700 cubic yards of material to be removed. To where? By 140 trips with 5 cubic yard dump trucks?

What is the proximate cause of these landslides?

How much for plpes to deliver propane, city water and sewage to the 250?
How much for a helipad?

Will the bridge, if built, be washed away by subsequent flooding? There are 5, 10, 20 and 100 year floods but the time intervals are getting shorter due to climate change.

if it's 'the bridge or nothing', see

"
I quote D. V. Lindley's Making Decisions, "Lord Kennet was forced to admit that the planning procedure is unsatisfactory and it is to be changed in the future so that inquiries into major projects can consider the options instead of merely a 'Yes' or 'No' to a particular scheme."
"
This drama was played out in England
http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/lords/1967/dec/11/stansted-site-and-third-london-airport
same issues, bigger bucks, more people involved.

The 'utility function' for restored access of the 250 is decidedly different than the others not affected by the slide. The others just see their money gone with no benefit to them except the goodwill of the [politically unconnected?] 250.
This is pretty hard to solve.

Here's the other side of the coin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge

This
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_bias
is another subject.



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Old 06-10-2014, 10:28 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nealtw View Post
After all is said and done will your home have resale value?
Yes, but @$100K less than before.


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Old 06-10-2014, 10:53 AM  
carnuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wuzzat? View Post
I'll parse your links for the 'message between the lines'. I can certainly use the practice.

You may also want to contact government oversight orgs but the one I went to said, in effect, 5000 people dying each year in the US unnecessarily is 'down in the noise.' AFAIK your group has not yet suffered casualties.

Supposedly almost no one can stand The Truth, but you guys are about to be confronted with it.
It's the truth about your state and federal governments and your fellow citizens.
And it's not like you asked for this revelation. It is being thrust upon you.
We took the red pill.

Quote:
So far,
$500K for a bridge.
"For HS25 Designs: Inventory Rating = 45 tons and Operating Rating = 75 tons."
That's quite a bridge.

Why this bridge? Why not "panel bridges; pedestrian bridges, including modular or fixed length trusses; vehicle or pedestrian beam bridges; fixed modular bridges; vertical lift, bascule, retractable, or swing movable bridges; pipe bridges"
Because of heavy equipment and it having to meet modern highway standards. It would still be a 2 mile hike for me if we just had a foot bridge.

Quote:
14' wide by 140' long by let's say 10' high = 700 cubic yards of material to be removed. To where? By 140 trips with 5 cubic yard dump trucks?
Where to put it is part of the problem. Some people are allowing dumping in their yards, but to me gray/blue clay has too much arsenic in it. The previous dump zones were deemed an eco-disaster that we had to spend $30K plus on mitigating so far.
The slide area "toe" is about 200 feet wide at the road, 1,000+ at the rear with the whole bowl slipping. The mountain above being held back by the toe "chocking" the base. Railway and Hwy 2 could be taken out in the event of a catastrophic failure.

Quote:
What is the proximate cause of these landslides?
Sort of undetermined. SNOPud had a geo engineer come out and "prove" it had nothing to do with their drilling/blasting. Major contributing factors were excess rain in a short time period and a clear cut above the slide that has been illegally expanded. (and still is by tweakers at night) Lack of drainage and a "pocket" of clay that is being pushed out by the pressure from above.

Quote:
How much for plpes to deliver propane, city water and sewage to the 250?
$million$. Last estimate $100 mil+

Quote:
How much for a helipad?
Already an unofficial one but DNR doesn't like flying in the area where animals are procreating.

Quote:
Will the bridge, if built, be washed away by subsequent flooding? There are 5, 10, 20 and 100 year floods but the time intervals are getting shorter due to climate change.
Unlikely. Railway bridge 100 feet upstream would go first. Bridge is made to use the current landings from the old bridge and extend 40 feet or so extra to take the pressure off the river embankments. Nothing will touch the river and the old pilings will just be there for looks.

Quote:

if it's 'the bridge or nothing', see

"
I quote D. V. Lindley's Making Decisions, "Lord Kennet was forced to admit that the planning procedure is unsatisfactory and it is to be changed in the future so that inquiries into major projects can consider the options instead of merely a 'Yes' or 'No' to a particular scheme."
"
This drama was played out in England
http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/lords/1967/dec/11/stansted-site-and-third-london-airport
same issues, bigger bucks, more people involved.

The 'utility function' for restored access of the 250 is decidedly different than the others not affected by the slide. The others just see their money gone with no benefit to them except the goodwill of the [politically unconnected?] 250.
This is pretty hard to solve.

Here's the other side of the coin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge

This
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_bias
is another subject.
The slide is pretty much from the left (worst hit area) to the right where cracks have started and the homes are falling down the hill (unsafe zone) with the road below it. More than enough to fill 2 Seattle stadiums.

mtindexslide.jpg  
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Old 06-10-2014, 11:58 AM  
Wuzzat?
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I'm stumped.

What all are the 250 doing about this?

There may be a
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tipping_Point
in this social situation.

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Old 06-12-2014, 11:45 AM  
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Sleeping with the devil. (or so the greenies think) Where it says Sunset falls (middle left side) is where the slide is. We got together with Snopud and they are buying access (since they plan to put this dam in, come hell or high water and need access and we had a bridge in place there before) for up to 1/2 the cost of the bridge (I think there is a $250K cap on it) including any legal fights with the greenies trying to block the bridge. We had a special assessment for $100K so far and we will need to pay about the same ($350 in my case) each year for the next 4 years.
The problem is many object to spending "their" money in such a way. (or any money for that matter because they feel the world owes them a living) The bridge is going over Canyon falls (middle right) which is a safe distance from the slide. We plan to get around the non-payers (mostly tweakers and the ones currently ransacking people's places up there) by installing a gate with remote control operated key code that you can only get if you are paid up or making payments on what you owe. The road coming in is one private land so it isn't subject to the same regulations as one of our roads.

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Old 06-12-2014, 12:37 PM  
nealtw
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We often here of disasters and the news move on. The time following desaster can be far worse. Before you are finished you will have a good understanding of politics, building codes, geo-engineering, strata finance and security., I would bet non of which is why you moved to that area.
This slide was taped.
http://dailypicksandflicks.com/2012/07/13/huge-mudslide-caught-on-camera-in-british-columbia-video/

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Old 06-17-2014, 10:00 AM  
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I posted that one up as an explanation to people of what could happen if our slide got momentum.

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Old 06-18-2014, 10:33 AM  
Wuzzat?
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Wiki has some good info on this.

"The area most generally recognized as being at risk of a dangerous mudslide are:
Areas where wildfires or human modification of the land have destroyed vegetation
Areas where landslides have occurred before
Steep slopes and areas at the bottom of slopes or canyons
Slopes that have been altered for construction of buildings and roads
Channels along a stream or river
Areas where surface runoff is directed"

Some of these can be blamed on human activity, and reasonably foreseeable.

Mud comes in at 2700 lbs per cubic yard and if it's moving it's like a battering ram.

I'm thinking now I should be looking at topographic maps for my location.

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Old 07-16-2014, 07:17 AM  
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Here's another mudslide
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/2014/06/30/03a8dca8-00c0-11e4-8fd0-3a663dfa68ac_story.html
this one caused by 'Marlboro Clay'.



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