HillyBilly special lean to lea to temp wall

It has taken me all day to learn to use a photo program. [to type in some words!]

I know it is hard to tell what is going on with all of the extra wood. I want to make sure I don't take down something that will make the roof cave in.

Im going to post the photos one at a time so I can comment.

Up first.
This is the problem area. Where it says hillbilly it is extra wood nailed on.

Here we have the 'ceiling joist'. It holds up the old roof. It is rotten and is being held up by a piece of wood for the drop ceiling, which is resting on rotten beams.

Here are the rafters stage Left (if you were on stage looking at the audience).

I don't know what is going on here. Is that one piece of vertical wood holding up the entire roof?

Here is stage Right. Notice the vertical piece of wood that rests on the old roof.

In order to build a temp wall, as I understand it, I am supposed to support the rafters with 2x4's cut at an angle on one end and a bottom plate on the other.

The old roof stage Left still has old roof on both sides of the 'ceiling joist' (which is rotten on one end and being held up by wood from the drop ceiling) But it doesn't look like the old roof on the front side is serving purpose at all.

Do I support the ceiling joist and remove the front part of the old roof, so I can build a temp wall by affixing 2x4's to the rafters?

What do I do with the rotten ceiling joist? It isn't supporting anything except old roof boards AND that one piece of wood stage Left.

Are there two pieces of wood holding up the roof?

Here is the old roof stage Left.

Im confused again!

Photo in post 25, some 6 or 8 ft of old sheeting has been removed to give a veiw of above, did you do that? Can you continue to remove the rest. peice by peice leaving anything that lools like it might be critical to the suport?

I think what you need to be looking at first is the foundation. Repairing a roof that has a rotting house under it is a waste of time and money.
You should find a good framing contractor and if you don't want to pay him to do the work, pay him to consult.

beachguy005 said:

I think what you need to be looking at first is the foundation. Repairing a roof that has a rotting house under it is a waste of time and money.
You should find a good framing contractor and if you don't want to pay him to do the work, pay him to consult.

Click to expand...

Normally I would agree with this but after looking at the photos of the house sitting on blocks and the fact the floor is held up with a rotton beam and the only way to to get to that beam is to dig your way in. The whole section is a house of cards. There is very little holding this roof together. Would you really suggest to put someone under this house in this condition.

I must of missed where I made the recommendation. Irrespective of your interpretation of my comment, foundation work can be, and is, done safely.

First off the live oaks IMO make the whole project worth doing.

Trying to piece together your photos in my head and it appears the wall that has the piece in it marked “Remove” with the cup hooks screwed into the bottom is a load bearing wall that ends at the rotted post marked “Replace”. If I’m seeing it right the short rafters are all carried on that wall. (Best shown in post #4)

That wall I only count 4 studs and it has the opening into the kitchen without much of a header. When you look under the floor where the building sets on the block piers is there a beam or more piers following along under that wall for support?

I agree with Neal start with the strapping that the drywall was attached to and get all that cleared out. I would save it as you can use it over later maybe. Then I would take a sawzall and start removing that old roofing that has no function one piece at a time to get that weight out and open it up.
Then that wall I was just talking about. I don’t think I would take that beam out that’s rotted on the end. As its holding up the middle of the building and I don’t know what you have to jack against to support that load. I would be tempted to go back that beam until it was solid and put a good strong post in there with support under it all the way to the ground then cut off the rotted end and sister some new stuff to it. Just not as hillbilly as the older repairs. Hopefully there is a good beam under that wall and you can add a few studs into that wall also.

This is the stuff I called Ice guard. We use it up north on problem spots.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Grace-Ic...i_gpa=pla&ci_src=17588969#product_description

I’m not a roofer and the roof guys may have better advice on your valley.

- House of cards: take the top cards off first… Then fix the table leg the house of cards is sitting on. Never build a house on a rotten table.


Do you want the good news first or the bad news?

I think I have good news. I don’t think any of the new roof is resting on the rotten wood. When someone built the living room onto the kitchen they built the new kitchen roof with it and just left the rotten wood.

Here are some photos.

And the bad.. I think.

This is what is holding up the load bearing wall and kitchen floor.

I don't know if you can tell, but there is one pier or post and a can supporting everything

The floor was built in steps.

The bedroom steps down into the kitchen which steps down onto the living room floor. Here is the bottom of the load bearing wall and the step up to the kitchen.

Do I try to access the underside of the house by removing some of the kitchen floor? Is it ok that there is only one pier or supporting the floor and load bearing wall? There have to be about 10 supporting the other side of the kitchen/bedroom.

Where do I go from here?

Thanks again!

So, still you want to take the old roof out carefully until you prove you are not disturbing the newer roof.
The beam under the floor is what like 1, 2, 3 ply 2x? or what and total length measure iinside house ddn't go under there and best guess distance to post. Then if you can get an eye on it, can you see a sag in it?

Everything in this post is about the construction of the kitchen, right? What condition is the rest of the house in? At some point you have to wonder if the building is worth all the effort and materials and costs. Of course, I don't know your situation and I am not one of the pros, so I can only ask questions from the outside. You certainly have the right guys answering questions for you.

Here's a download with way more info than you need at the moment. I've seen it posted here before and it has lots of details that can be helpful. At the least, it will help with a common language for all the parts and connections:
http://www.awc.org/pdf/wcd1-300.pdf

When you say one pier holding it up that’s the one in the middle of the beam? You also have one on each end of the beam? Answer Neal’s question if you can and along with the beam size what’s the length and also the distance between support points (piers)?

The new construction looks like it was put in with the addition and also to work with that bad beam they left. What is the stud spacing on the new wall? Is the new wall directly over the beam in the crawl space.

As to how much to do and the value in doing it. The answer to that is only known to the person with the house. I know in my life my opinion of value changed many times based around my ability to pay for something better. It sounds to me like the OP values having a place that’s his and paid for. And the photos show me they are not afraid of some hard work to make it livable, so based around that and the fact the labor is free this place looks like a lot of labor and a careful use of materials I say keep going and every little step makes it better.

I was just raising the question; I wouldn't try to answer it from where I sit. But it occurred to me that if the whole house looked like this, you could put a trailer on the property and start from scratch.

I see that there are neighbors nearby. I wonder what kind of info they can share about this building.

Thanks Bud for the ice damn link, and slowandsteady for the pdf it should help. I probably should read it before this post.

Slowand Steady:
The rest of the house was built right. The house was free. This is a weekend lake house area. One house was rented because of the economy and there is a 70+ year old woman that might remember something about it being built, but I don’t know how much she knows about construction. I found a paper from 1954 saying that the water was tested as safe, and something about a volunteer fire department in the kitchen wall. I know the initial house was built in 1940. Perhaps the add on was built in 1954.

The shed was built right. It is the size of a two car garage with an A frame. There is electricity but no plumbing. I guess I could build an outhouse and go with the theme. Hook up the tankless water heater in the shed.


I know how you love my ultra drawings so, I have made another.
These are the problem areas of the house. The other side of the house is fine. It is the kitchen roof where all of the water pours off that has caused the problems and the kitchen’s foundation, which may have shifted because of the rotten beam (where the water splashed).

The house was built like steps up/down. There might be one 2x4 under the load bearing ‘wall’ in the kitchen.
I might have exactly the same problem the hillbilly did with the original roof. All of the water from the entire house


Nealtw:
The kitchen is 13’ long
There are 3 piers. The one in the middle is about at 7 1/2 feet between the two.
There are 2 2x4’s as a joist I guess. There is a problem. See photo.

The photo in post #33 shows the stage Right view



Bud:
It was built outside of the kitchen, after it steps down.
I can’t tell where the new wall has been built. Im guessing on top of ONE of the leaning 2x4’s in the crawl space that support the kitchen floor joists.
Post #33 shows the kitchen joists resting on the 2 slanting 2x4’s.
Post #34 shows the step down from the kitchen onto the living room floor. Which would make the load bearing wall resting on nothing structural, just the living room floor.


Maybe the new photos help.

I think if I rip the old kitchen wood out, replace the rotten green beam, and replace the load bearing wall with something like how a garage is built, I should be set. Right? As far as this kitchen mess. Then do what I need to seal the roof and look into gutter…?

If I can get everything except the Big Boy work done I might be able to call a couple of friends to help.

Thanks guys!

Stage-left-Crawl-Space

There is a pier and beam about 7 1/2 feet in-between the piers on the outside of the house.