Theater Room Floor

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Boyle

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I should probably start by saying I am not very "Handy" when it comes to floors, walls, or cellings... so I am here for help.

When I bought my house we had 2 living rooms, the one downstairs was basically used for storage while we got things set up. Now I need to do something with the flooring in that room. The flooring they had down was cracking and stained beyond cleaning. I started to remove it. The back side of the flooring is not coming up as easily as I hoped.

What would be a good way to remove the sticky part still stuck down on the wood. Here are a few pictures for reference.

Apparently I need 5 posts to post pictures/links.
 
I tried my hardest to not spam to get the 5 posts : (.

I failed at my first attempt at uploading them for some reason.
 
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You seem to be trying to post them using HTML. The forum software uses a different protocol for photos

my.php


my.php


my.php
 
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That works much better. However, I am at a loss to help you with this particular problem. However, someone with knowledge will chime in.

There is a 5 picture limit per post. That may have limited you earlier.
 
That works much better. However, I am at a loss to help you with this particular problem. However, someone with knowledge will chime in.

There is a 5 picture limit per post. That may have limited you earlier.

Thanks for the help, yea I tried it with 6 pictures and had to do it over again with 5. But I think 5 is good enough to convey what I am trying to replace. I hope at least.
 
Hello Boyle:
Rental places have an electric machine with an oscilating blade on the front that does a bang-up job of stripping concrete floors. It is called different names in different areas but I call it a floor stripping machine.
Glenn
 
Boyle:

Take a look at this web page, it shows all the tools you'll need:

Crain Tools | Tear-out Tools

The electric flooring stripper (The 700 Bearcat) works well if you're taking glued down flooring off a concrete floor. The problem is that it'll chip up wood underlayment really badly. If there's wood under this flooring, I'd just use hand tools here instead.

First off, this is the first time I've seen an asphalt impregnated paper backing on what appears to be linoleum. Normally, you see a white paper backing on linoleums, and the black asphalt impregnated paper only on linoleum tiles. They use asphalt impregnated paper on the back of "linoleum tiles" so that if the floor got wet, the paper under the tiles wouldn't absorb water and swell up, typically resulting in the corners of the tiles lifting and curling up. Under linoleum (which doesn't have joints where water can get in like tile does), why would they use asphalt impregnated paper?

Anyhow, the very best tool I know of for taking this kind of flooring up is the #157 molding lifter at the bottom of the page. It has a wide head at the bottom that spreads the prying force over a larger area of flooring and that helps in preventing the flooring from tearing. Try to get the blade under the paper, but if you can't, use the tool just to take the vinyl wear layer off. They cost about $15, but you'll find you'll use it a lot for other DIY work as well.

Once you get the wear layer off, you remove the asphalt impregnated paper with the 20 inch #360 Pro Stripper. Home Depot sells the 12 inch version as a "wallpaper scraper", which is stupid cuz the blades on these things are far too sharp to be used on wet drywall. At best, you could only use them to scrape wall paper off of plaster walls. You'd really muck up wet drywall with it.

Basically, you use the #360 (or competitor's equivalent) with a sweeping kinda motion to slice the paper off the floor. When the blade is new, even pushing the blade under the paper will often allow you to scrape it cleanly off the underlying floor, but that doesn't happen often. This tool ships with the blade installed backward so that people don't cut themselves handling it. IT IS INEVITABLE that you're going to put quite a few gouges into your wood underlayment slicing the paper off, but you just patch those with a cement based floor leveler like Mapei Planipatch. Buy plenty of blades cuz you'll be going through them quickly. At any place that sells flooring supplies you'll be able to buy 100 four inch flooring razor blades for about $50. You'll go through a lot of them. Also, if you have a scrap piece of glass that's thick enough to support some pressure, just tape down some 600 grit sand paper to the glass, and you can sharpen your flooring razor blades to get extra life out of them.

When I strip the WHITE paper backed linoleum off of bathroom floors, I use a trick to get the residual paper off. (You CAN use a heat gun to soften the glue and scrape the paper off the glue, but there's an easier way.) I just do some testing on any exposed adhesive to find out what dissolves it. Typically I find that lacquer thinner (which is 75% toluene) will dissolve most old flooring adhesives. Then, apply that solvent to the residual paper left after stripping with the flooring razor, spread it over a strip of residual paper about a foot wide, cover with wax paper and weigh down the edges of the wax paper (with a chain or sticks or whatever) so that the solvent doesn't evaporate. With time, the solvent will penetrate through the paper, and when it comes to the paper/glue boundary it will dissolve the glue at that boundary, and then the paper can then be easily scraped off the glue with a putty knife. You can then do a repeat performance to dissolve the glue layer and scrape it off the floor with a putty knife too.

Obviously, behave responsibly whenever using flammable solvents and provide plenty of ventilation to the work area.

The "Installations Manager" at any flooring retailer will know who sells flooring tools in your area. Crain and Gundlach are both well respected names in flooring tools. Roberts sells mostly flooring installation supplies like adhesives and tackstrip, but also sells some flooring tools. I think Roberts is mostly into carpet installation tools.

Boyle:
On the top picture there are some drywall screw heads visible. On the floor directly in front of the left most drywall screw head I see a patch of floor with what looks like dried brownish adhesive on it. I want you to take some ordinary tap water and put it on that brownish adhesive and see if water dissolves that brown adhesive.

PS: To minimize the wood floor being discoloured by asphalt dissolving in the solvent and then being wicked into the dry wood underlayment, see if you can get the underlying wood wet where-ever possible before using the solvent to remove the paper or glue. Wet wood won't wick dirty solvent in like dry wood. (Even if the wood is badly discoloured, I think you should be able to float the floor with a cement based floor leveler to prep it for the new floor. You might just have to use more additive in the floor leveler tho.
 
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Thank you sooo much for the reply. When I get home I will try what you suggested. Before I get home from work I will try and hit the hardware store and see what I can get tonight to get started. I will post updates.
 
Thank you sooo much for the reply. When I get home I will try what you suggested. Before I get home from work I will try and hit the hardware store and see what I can get tonight to get started. I will post updates.

PICTURES, PICTURES, we want PICTURES!!!
PICTURES, PICTURES, we want PICTURES!!!
PICTURES, PICTURES, we want PICTURES!!!
:agree:
 
is there any negative effects to me leaving the paper attached to the wood in spots?

Also I am looking at options on what I want to put down on the floor right now. Not sure if I want to go rug, or something else... any opinions?
 
is there any negative effects to me leaving the paper attached to the wood in spots?

I wouldn't do that. If you're going to install carpet over the floor, I suppose you might get away with it. But, a thinner flooring like sheet vinyl will show "lumps" under the flooring where the paper should have been removed but wasn't.

Also I am looking at options on what I want to put down on the floor right now. Not sure if I want to go rug, or something else... any opinions?

If this is supposed to be a theatre room, then carpet is a good choice. It helps absorb sound so that the room below is a bit quieter. If you go with carpet, go with a "solution dyed nylon" carpet. Nylon is the strongest fiber used to make carpet from, so nylon carpets make for the longest wearing carpets. Over 80 percent of commercial carpets intended for commercial applications are made of nylon. Also, the term "solution dyed" means that the carpet is coloured by adding tiny pigments to the molten nylon before drawing it into a fiber. As a result, those coloured pigments are encased in nylon plastic, and you can use bleach on a solution dyed nylon carpet without harming the colour of the carpet. So, you can use bleach to remove otherwise impossible stains from a solution dyed nylon carpet without harming the carpet.
 
PS: You have little to lose by buying one of those car floor mat size samples of a solution dyed nylon carpet and torturing it with bleach to confirm that it's not harmed by bleach.
 
That sounds like the perfect solution. I will price some for the room. I heard from a guy that the padding under carpet isnt Absolutely necessary. Is that true?

The room is 15 x 15

Will hardware stores like Lowes or Home Depot have this type of carpet? I am not experienced in buying carpet, but will I get a better price from a smaller retailer or should i stick with Lowes/Home Depot?
 
That sounds like the perfect solution. I will price some for the room. I heard from a guy that the padding under carpet isnt Absolutely necessary. Is that true?
No, most commercial carpet is installed by glueing it down to bare concrete without any underpad under it. But, that's typically done only in commercial settings where perhaps part of the reason is that carpet without underpad offers less roll resistance for people in wheelchairs. Also, people tend to drag their feet when they walk, so they're more inclined to catch their foot on a softer carpet with underpad and trip than on a harder carpet without a pad.

In a residential setting, virtually all carpet installed in private homes is installed over underpad. The underpad makes the carpet feel warmer if it's installed over concrete or you're walking on it with socks or bare feet, it makes the carpet last longer by absorbing much of the shock of each foot fall, and it, and it makes thin pile carpets feel thicker. If I were you, I would definitely install your carpet over 6 to 8 pound foam chip underpad. That means the foam chip pad weighs 6 to 8 pounds per cubic foot. That's the underpad that gives you the most bang for the buck, and it's probably the most popular underpad for residential carpets.

The room is 15 x 15.

That MAY be a problem, depending on how much you're willing to pay for the installation of the carpet. You see, carpet comes in three different widths; 12 foot wide, 13' 6" wide and 15 foot wide, with 12' being the most common by far. About the only carpets that come 15 feet wide are Berbers, and so far as I know, solution dyed nylon carpet only comes in level loop commercial carpet, not in any berbers.

So, if you want to save on installation costs, you can opt to have a 15 foot wide berber installed, but you won't find one made with solution dyed nylon. You will find ordinary dyed nylon 15 foot wide berbers and 100% Olefin (pronounced: "polypropylene") 15 foot wide berbers. The ordinary nylon carpets will be dyed normally, and so you can't use bleach on them without taking the colour out. The 100% Olefin carpets will be solution dyed, so you can use bleach without affecting the colour, but Olefin is a weaker fiber and the carpet tends to show wear patterns a lot sooner.

You can buy a 12 foot wide carpet in a solution dyed nylon, but carpet has a "grain" to it (kinda like wood) in that each tuft of the carpet will be leaning slightly in the direction it came off the carpet mill. That lean is permanent.

If you want to install a 12 foot wide carpet in a 15 foot wide room, you have to ensure that the tufts are all leaning in the same direction everywhere in the room. So, in that case you'll have to order a 18 foot 9 inch long piece of 12 foot wide carpet and cut a 12 foot wide, 3' 9" inch long piece off the end. Then, you cut that 12 foot wide, 3 foot 9 inch long piece into four pieces each 3 feet wide and 3 feet 9 inches long. The installers will hot melt tape those pieces end-to-end, being careful that the tufts lean in the same direction on each piece, to make a strip of carpet 3 feet wide and 15 feet long. They will then hot melt tape that to the 15 foot long by 12 foot wide piece of carpet to make a carpet 15 feet wide and 15 feet long that they can install into your room.

Obviously, it takes more time and labour to do that than to install a berber carpet that comes 15 feet wide.

Will hardware stores like Lowes or Home Depot have this type of carpet?
I kinda doubt that Lowes or Home Depot would sell either solution dyed nylon carpet or 15 foot wide carpet, but you should ask. They will sell 12 foot wide 100% Olefin carpet, tho, as well as 12 foot wide conventionally dyed nylon carpet. There's no harm in asking. Maybe print off this post and explain the problem to the flooring salesman there, and see if they'll special order carpet for you.

I am not experienced in buying carpet, but will I get a better price from a smaller retailer or should i stick with Lowes/Home Depot?

I'd say you're sure to get a better price on the carpet of your choice from a home center simply because their business model is to sell in high volume at lower prices. You get better service and more knowledgeable sales staff at a privately owned carpet retail store.
 
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