Nm-b romex run outdoors

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alexb5647

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My uncle has a log cabin that he gave to me and it was built back in the 40's. Since he's was an industrial electrician he redid the electrical in 1990 because of few plugs and knob and tube wiring. In order to avoid so many wires running along the wall he decided to drill through the floor and run the wire under the cabin to the next plug, switch, or if its a home run line. I looked under the cabin just recently and he just ran the romex loosely and it's laying on the ground. It doesn't look deteriorated or chewed. Some circuits close to the panel he just stapled the cable real nice and neat along the wall or ceiling. All junctions have covers and romex clamps on all boxes. All cables are stapled within 6" of fixture and stapled every 12". Also he put in some outdoor lighting on the porch and he just drilled through the logs from the inside and just ran romex out to the light. Is this acceptable by code? My uncle is not around anymore so I can't ask him. Any info would be appreciated.
 
If the life of Romex is 50 years, one question is: "How long will NMB last under these conditions?"
And, "Is it long enough?"
 
I was just wondering if this is up to code. I'm sure i will have to replace it in the future. I'll just run 12-2 UF with conduit when I replace it. The underside of my cabin is dirt which is always dry. I just wasn't sure if romex being outside and laying on the ground is ok.
 
I sure hope the life of Romex is more than 50 years. My house is 55 years old and has never been rewired.
 
JoeD said:
I sure hope the life of Romex is more than 50 years. My house is 55 years old and has never been rewired.
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The cable guy who told me that did/could not define "End of Life" for Romex.
 
nealtw said:
I wouldn't leave them laying on the ground.
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It's probably classified in the NEC as a damp or wet location and so you are supposed to use UF cable.
I guess if you megger it once in a while and see a significant degradation in the insulation resistance it should be replaced.
Another test would be to put a GFCI upstream of this cable.
 
alexb5647 said:
I stapled them to the joists so there not on the ground anymore.
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Then the question is: "Can NMB be used in an unconditioned space?" If the cable sees more than 30C you might need to derate.
 
Then the question is: "Can NMB be used in an unconditioned space?" If the cable sees more than 30C you might need to derate.
Wouldn't that be the same as an attic with a moisture problem.
 
nealtw said:
Then the question is: "Can NMB be used in an unconditioned space?" If the cable sees more than 30C you might need to derate.
Wouldn't that be the same as an attic with a moisture problem.
Click to expand...

Yes, unless the cable has some kind of cognition that we do not and can not know about (see Emergence). :p
Always a pleasure, nealtw. . .
 
alexb5647 said:
My uncle has a log cabin that he gave to me and it was built back in the 40's. Since he's was an industrial electrician he redid the electrical in 1990 because of few plugs and knob and tube wiring. In order to avoid so many wires running along the wall he decided to drill through the floor and run the wire under the cabin to the next plug, switch, or if its a home run line. I looked under the cabin just recently and he just ran the romex loosely and it's laying on the ground. It doesn't look deteriorated or chewed. Some circuits close to the panel he just stapled the cable real nice and neat along the wall or ceiling. All junctions have covers and romex clamps on all boxes. All cables are stapled within 6" of fixture and stapled every 12". Also he put in some outdoor lighting on the porch and he just drilled through the logs from the inside and just ran romex out to the light. Is this acceptable by code? My uncle is not around anymore so I can't ask him. Any info would be appreciated.
Click to expand...
If you ever replace this cable you would need to use the UF-B product Romex ®NM-B cable. It is permitted to be used “for both exposed and concealed work in normally dry locations” per NEC® 334.10(A)(1) and not permitted in “damp or wet” locations per NEC 334.12(B)(4). Any cable lying on the ground needs to be supported. - The cable needs to be supported and secured every 4’ and within 12” of each box, cabinet, conduit, or other termination. NEC 334.30(A)
This answer is intended to apply to Romex® Brand NM Cable. For other NM cables, please check with those respective brand suppliers or cable manufacturers. Romex® is a Registered Trademark of Southwire Company.
This communication is for general informational purposes only and is not intended to constitute advice. As all the facts and circumstances in any given situation may not be apparent, this communication is not intended to be, and should not be, relied upon by the reader in making decisions with respect to the issues discussed herein, and the reader assumes the risk if he or she chooses to do so. The reader is encouraged to consult an expert before making any decisions or taking any action concerning the matters in this communication. All warranties, express or implied, including warranties regarding accuracy, adequacy, completeness, legality, reliability, safety or usefulness of any information, ARE DISCLAIMED. Southwire Company is not liable for any damages however caused and on any theory of liability arising in any way out of the information provided or the reader's use of it.
 
Hey Romex: Welcome, great info until you dropped your lawyer on us. All that legal stuff is understud here
 
How nice to have you very own cabin!

If you are running conduit, you need stranded wiring, not UF or ROMEX sheathed. Heat builds up and so code requires strands. UF can be undergrounded but the aboveground stubs should be in conduit until you hit the required depth in the dirt (prevents critter gnawing on live wiring).

In California, we are required to bury UF or conduit a minimum of 14" below ground (which is exactly what I did today, BTW). :D

Here is a resource for you to consider: http://www.familyhandyman.com/DIY-P...Wiring/how-to-bury-underground-cable/View-All
 
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CallMeVilla said:
How nice to have you very own cabin!

If you are running conduit, you need stranded wiring, not UF or ROMEX sheathed. Heat builds up and so code requires strands. UF can be undergrounded but the aboveground stubs should be in conduit until you hit the required depth in the dirt (prevents critter gnawing on live wiring).

In California, we are required to bury UF or conduit a minimum of 14" below ground (which is exactly what I did today, BTW). :D

Here is a resource for you to consider: http://www.familyhandyman.com/DIY-Projects/Electrical/Electrical-Wiring/how-to-bury-underground-cable/View-All
Click to expand...

What code is that exactly?!
 
In case you did NOT read the very helpful article from The Family Handyman I provided, here is the pic for buried plastic pipe wiring ... Note also the more shallow undergrounded wiring is encased in metal conduit .... BUT BOTH are done without the ROMEX sheathing.

Underground.jpg
 
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