How to handle wall problem?

Discussion in 'Flooring' started by Jordi88, Jan 2, 2008.

  1. Jan 2, 2008 #1

    Jordi88

    Jordi88

    Jordi88

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    I am in the process of remodeling my bathroom. Today I removed a tacky wallpaper border the previous owner had installed and discovered under it chipping paint. I've never dealt with chipping paint before, I've been told to sand down the area and primer it.

    What confuses me, is while I was removing the wallpaper, I noticed a brown almost cardboard like material was exposed where the paint had chipped off. When I would spray the area with water (to loosen up the wallpapers adhesive) this cardboard like material easily came off and exposed a light brown board.

    There is so much chipping I don't know if sanding the area would even look good? Should I chip off the remaining paint and remove this cardboard like material and then primer that area?

    The picture I have attached is an area where I removed the chipping paint and the cardboard like material... Any guidance would be great.


    Picture015.jpg
     
  2. Jan 2, 2008 #2

    ToolGuy

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    Hi Jordi,

    I've run into this a lot and it could be one of a few things. It may be old wall paper from the 1920's or 50's on top of plaster, it may be the paper surface of drywall, or it could be the surface of an old hardboard wall. Whatever the case, the more you get it wet the more it will loosen and peel away.

    What you need to do is peel away any that is already loose, then seal what's left with an oil based primer, such as Kilz. Make sure to get the oil base type. Use a cheap disposable brush so you don't have to clean it.

    Apply the primer generously but not so much that it runs or drips. Let it completely dry. For Kilz that would be a couple of hours, but some other primers may take over night.

    After it's dry, sand it with a fine grit sanding sponge. You can get one at the paint or hardware store where you bought he primer. Be careful not to sand through the primer, especially at the edges of the peeling where there is a ridge. What you want to do is sand away any course texture or lint that was dried into the primer, so you have a smooth surface to work on.

    After sanding you can skim the area with spackle or setting type joint compound. If it's not too big of an area you might want to use a light weight spackle, like Red Devil "One Step", but any brand will do. You can tell the light weight spackle by the weight of the plastic container it comes in. The old type spackle will feel heavy and the light weight feels like the container is half empty.

    A 4 inch or 6 inch flexible taping knife is ideal for this purpose. You could get a plastic one cheap, or invest $8 in a steel one. Apply a thin coat, just enough to fill the depression left by the peeling, and try to keep it as smooth as you can. It may be easier to do it in 2 applications, but any ridges will be difficult to sand.

    When the spackle is good and dry, say overnight, sand it with the same fine grit sand paper to smooth out any slight ridges. Prime it with the same oil based primer, and paint like normal. Done properly, the repair should be permanant and invisible.

    Let us know how it goes and feel free to ask if you need more help. ;)
     
  3. Jan 2, 2008 #3

    Jordi88

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    Awesome! This answers a lot of my questions. However, one answer spawns another question. :) On that cardboard like material I referenced earlier, I sprayed an area of it with water and peed it away. Underneath was a light green paint with different types of leaves outlined in white. Underneath this green paint is what appears to be hardboard.

    Can I just remove all layers of paint and prime and paint the hardboard? Please forgive me if this is a stupid question. I'm 19 years old and just bought my first house. I'm still learning... :|
     
  4. Jan 2, 2008 #4

    ToolGuy

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    Just by reading my reply you already know more than I did at 19. :p

    What you may have there is layers upon layers of old wall paper over wood-lath plaster. I've removed entire apartment's of the stuff and sometimes the walls are sound while other times it turns out the paper is actually holding the plaster together. If your house was built between 1900 and 1930, I'm guessing this is the case.

    If it was built later, say '50s or so, then it's probably drywall. Without seeing more of it, there's no way I can say for sure.

    I doubt that it's hardboard, which is not actually that hard. It's basically paper about 1/2 inch thick. Whatever the case, there's not really any benefit to removing more than necessary, except maybe if you're just curious. If you want to see what's under there, I'd say go ahead. Whatever you do, it's going to need patched, but the deeper you dig the more you have to patch. Also, if you get much deeper, using the light weight spackle will no longer be the better way to go.

    If you decide to remove more (you're doing so right now, aren't you), then post a couple more photos, maybe of the whole wall so I can get a better idea of the construciton. The more information I have, the better I can advise.

    I gotta hit the sack, but I'll check in tomorrow after work to see how you're doing.

    Later! ;)
     
  5. Jan 3, 2008 #5

    Jordi88

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    Two of four walls have chipping paint present. What I find odd about the whole issue is that below a certain point on the wall (see the dark blue lower portion of the wall in the picture) the paint is perfectly find and can not and does not need to be chipped.

    I felt This area had been originally too big for the spackle remedy to be effective. I've decided to chip off all the paint and wallpaper, sand down what is left, and prime and paint the wall. On one of the walls I am going to use your spackle remedy.

    And one other thing. My house was built in 1915.

    Picture016.jpg
     
  6. Jan 3, 2008 #6

    Jordi88

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    Change of plans. I have sanded down all the walls and scraped off any lose materials. Now I am going to buy some Drywall Joint Compound and spread it out over the chipped area. Now my questions for this step are:

    1. Can I use all purpose compound?

    2. Do I just spread it all over the chipped out area?

    3. Do I apply as many coats as necessary to get it flush with the other paint?

    This is pretty much the same thing as your spackle remedy. I just have never used dry wall compound before.
     
  7. Jan 3, 2008 #7

    ToolGuy

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    Yeah, that looks like layers of old wall paper. 1915, it makes sense. It's most likely wood lath plaster. If the plaster is in good shape, you're lucky.

    You need to wash off the old glue. Use a course scrub pad and warm water, it will clean up easily. Let it completely dry and seal it with Kilz primer. Then you can skim it with compound without further loosening the exposed edges of the paper.

    If there are any cracks they should be fixed. Use a utility knife to cut them open to the wood lath, then fill them with a medium/thick mix of setting type compound, mashing it in to key into the lath. Easy Sand 90 is good for this. It sets in about 90 minutes. I use 5 or 20 for this, but then I'm not in the learning phase. ;)

    You can also use a thin mix of Easy Sand 90 for your skim coat. The thinner you're able to work with it, the better. I like to mix it in a 5 gal. bucket and use a 6" and 12" taping knives to work with. Don't mix more than you need or it will set up in the bucket and go to waste. Use the same scrub pad to clean your bucket and tools after each coat of compound.

    If you don't skim the area you stripped, at least the edges, you'll see it after painting - especially with that light right next to it, shining right across it.

    About that lower part, I'm guessing it had tile or something, thus never had the wall paper.

    So... Did you realize what a can of worms you were opening when you started this little task? Welcome to my world. :D

    Oh, and here's a little article I contributed to ehow.com. Not the same project, but related.

    http://www.ehow.com/how_2070730_permanently-repair-cracked-plaster-walls.html
     
  8. Jan 4, 2008 #8

    Jordi88

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    My relator said all it should take is a fresh coat of paint. :(
     
  9. Jan 4, 2008 #9

    ToolGuy

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    Oh, you mean you're unbiased realtor? :rolleyes:

    There's no way around it, if you want to restore or upgrade an old house and do it right, it involves a lot of work. Why do you think guys like me are so expensive to hire? :D So just think about how much money your saving.

    If you tackle one room at a time through to completion, you're going to have one awesome old house. It may take a couple of years, but it's well worth it.

    By the way, do you still have all the old trim still intact?
     
  10. Jan 5, 2008 #10

    Jordi88

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    On one of the other walls in my bathroom was a small area of chipped paint. I bought the Easy Sand 90 and mixed it and attempted to apply it to the area. It is still drying and I don't know if I did a good job.... You can still see the the chipped out area.... I need to apply another coat when it dries and then sand it down....

    New Image.JPG
     
  11. Jan 5, 2008 #11

    ToolGuy

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    It's hard to tell from a photo, but whatever you do can be sanded. That's why they call it Easy Sand. ;)

    After it's dry, scrape off the ridges and high spots as best you can before applying the second coat. You can use a course sanding sponge or 80 grit sand paper wrapped around a wood block to get it smooth. If you go through the primer and expose the brown paper, touch it up before applying the second coat of mud (technical term :) )

    If you get the second coat smooth enough you might be able to use a wet sponge to finish it, but that takes a bit of practice. You might be better off sanding the second coat with 100 grit paper or a medium sponge.

    Later! :)
     
  12. Jan 6, 2008 #12

    SeanH

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    The best primer in the world is Guardz. I would highly recomend this over kilz or anything else. This will allow you to float any uneven areas without any moisture issues. If you would like to save time on making the walls smooth you might want to look at a product like Weathered Stone.
    http://www.weathered-stone.com
     
  13. Jan 6, 2008 #13

    ToolGuy

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    :mad: Quit selling you f**ing product to our guests. Have you ever heard of this thing called respect? And if you're going to offer advice, at least know what the hell you're talking about. Guardz is water based and will cause the paper to blister.
     
  14. Jan 12, 2008 #14

    student001

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    Hello,

    I am preparing the walls and ceiling of a room for a smooth finish with eggshell/semigloss paint on top. After sanding, I notice I saw streaks left by the sandpaper. Does a coat of primer on top cover those scratch marks? Or Do I need to spray a light texture on top? Appreciate any help!!:)

    Thank You
     
  15. Jan 13, 2008 #15

    inspectorD

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    Just take a damp sponge or cloth and smooth down any sanding marks. Then primer and you should be ok. If not you can get some light filling putty and it should take care of it. Good luck.:)
     
  16. Jan 13, 2008 #16

    booft

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    haha

    Dude you are awesome, I run around this site reading up a ton of things, and Im always surprised by the level of respect you have for new people starting out. Just reading this thread (and the above quote) made me a little more knowledgable (Ive always wanted to work on an old house) and get a couple chuckles in too.
     
  17. Jan 14, 2008 #17

    ToolGuy

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    I'm normally pretty cool headed, but sometimes these spammers bring out the worst in me. But I'm glad you got a kick out of my little outburst. I did too. ;)
     
  18. Jan 14, 2008 #18

    ToolGuy

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    I see those scratches left behind quite often and always makes me think poor workmanship cuz they didn't bother to smooth it out. I usually follow up sanding with a finer grit (100 or 120) before calling it done. A fine to medium sanding sponge works well for this purpose.

    What inspectorD suggests, using a damp sponge or rag, also works well, and doesn't create yet more dust. Don't get it too wet though or you'll replace the scrath marks with swirl marks. Primer and a couple of coats of paint do tend to fill in the finest scratches, but better to make sure it's smooth before priming. ;)
     
  19. Dec 29, 2011 #19

    4redwood

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    If what you ar doing , is consuming so much time ,and energy simply do yourself a favor ,buy some 1/4 inch 12 ft sheets and rock the whole thing tape tex and be done with a surface completely blemish free .
     

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