David Newell
Member
Greetings:
Background
I was an "early adapter" when it came to Solar Heating, and had a thermal "drain down" solar water heater installed in the early 90's. Then, about 10 years later, it was updated to a glycol heat-transfer system.
All by the same contractor locally, with a C10 "general" and a ?? "solar" CSLB ticket.
About 2 years ago, the same guy put in a replacement Rheem water heater, the prior one of which had sprung a small but irreparable leak . Just outside the warranty period of 10 years. The new one is a mere 6 years.
So, towards the end of last winter, the backup electric heater failed. Presuming it was breakers, I lived thru a hot summer's provision of hot water, but the days are getting shorter, and I got off my lazy butt..
and it's not the breakers! So it has to be in the supply armored Romex in the attic, of about 110 feet.
Well, after my back operation, I ain't crawlin' 'round my attic....
SO, since I'm in the process of getting solar electric panels installed, I figured I could sneak in the extra work for the water heater power supply on top of the $30K+ electric installation, with little extra cash outlay.
So the guy bidding the job solar electric wanted to look at the panel, to see if there was space, (which there is), and he said
"??Why are there two 30 amp ganged breakers feeding 12 gauge wires??"
Well, those breakers are for the solar hot water back up mentioned above.
and after seeing the other end, also 12 gauge..
the fellow speculated that there was perhaps a heating event at a junction b ox, with a loosened wire nut
causing one leg to be around 40 volts, at the water heater disconnect box .
But, 4500/3380 is on the side of the tank,
which I suppose is starting wattage, cold heater: and "running" when heated up...??
So starting current draw is right at 20 1/2 amps.
According to tables on-line,
a 20 amp carry at 110' should require a 10 or even 8 gauge wire.
1. I think the breakers should be 20 amp "slo-blo", to handle the start-up current,
(IS there a 25 amp breaker??)
2. All the wire should be heavier than 12 gauge
3. Probably the problem is in the Jboxes in the attic.
=========================
SO:
I called the contractor, 16 months after installation, and HE said
"Dude, there's only 1 year warrantee..."
My stating it had failed within a year, but I was to stupid to report it, elicited a yawn.
I stated the facts of the matter, and he said
"The house was permitted when it was built, and we just tied into what was there."
"The codes may have changed, but they were what was there: you think we have X Ray vision?"
Well, how about the mismatch between the 30 amps an the 12 gauge?
"Like I said, not our job or responsibility."
IMHO, I think a contractor has a duty to advise homeowners if something is not up to code,
and if it is a safety issue, either refuse to install the appliance (or whatever): or insist on a change order.
Further, i think the statute of limitations on an unsafe, faulty install is NOT limited to "one year",
but 4 years if it is noted: and ten years if a fire or other hazard causes loss because of it.
==================
I've told him what I think:
I've sent references to codes I think apply:
and I've said that I would pay for wire and circuit breakers if needed,
but he needs to get the install corrected to current codes .
I've given him a week to yea or nay,
and then I will go to CSLB and file a complaint,
get a forensic Electician to make repairs and take pictures,
pay for that service,
and commence trying for recovery from the contractor
down the pay-a-lawyer route.
(I've NEVER sued anyone..)
========================
So anyway, if I'm FOS, please advise.
I that a fair offer?
Any other suggestions?
Thanks to my friend Rich, who turned me on to this site.
Regards,
David
Background
I was an "early adapter" when it came to Solar Heating, and had a thermal "drain down" solar water heater installed in the early 90's. Then, about 10 years later, it was updated to a glycol heat-transfer system.
All by the same contractor locally, with a C10 "general" and a ?? "solar" CSLB ticket.
About 2 years ago, the same guy put in a replacement Rheem water heater, the prior one of which had sprung a small but irreparable leak . Just outside the warranty period of 10 years. The new one is a mere 6 years.
So, towards the end of last winter, the backup electric heater failed. Presuming it was breakers, I lived thru a hot summer's provision of hot water, but the days are getting shorter, and I got off my lazy butt..
and it's not the breakers! So it has to be in the supply armored Romex in the attic, of about 110 feet.
Well, after my back operation, I ain't crawlin' 'round my attic....
SO, since I'm in the process of getting solar electric panels installed, I figured I could sneak in the extra work for the water heater power supply on top of the $30K+ electric installation, with little extra cash outlay.
So the guy bidding the job solar electric wanted to look at the panel, to see if there was space, (which there is), and he said
"??Why are there two 30 amp ganged breakers feeding 12 gauge wires??"
Well, those breakers are for the solar hot water back up mentioned above.
and after seeing the other end, also 12 gauge..
the fellow speculated that there was perhaps a heating event at a junction b ox, with a loosened wire nut
causing one leg to be around 40 volts, at the water heater disconnect box .
But, 4500/3380 is on the side of the tank,
which I suppose is starting wattage, cold heater: and "running" when heated up...??
So starting current draw is right at 20 1/2 amps.
According to tables on-line,
a 20 amp carry at 110' should require a 10 or even 8 gauge wire.
1. I think the breakers should be 20 amp "slo-blo", to handle the start-up current,
(IS there a 25 amp breaker??)
2. All the wire should be heavier than 12 gauge
3. Probably the problem is in the Jboxes in the attic.
=========================
SO:
I called the contractor, 16 months after installation, and HE said
"Dude, there's only 1 year warrantee..."
My stating it had failed within a year, but I was to stupid to report it, elicited a yawn.
I stated the facts of the matter, and he said
"The house was permitted when it was built, and we just tied into what was there."
"The codes may have changed, but they were what was there: you think we have X Ray vision?"
Well, how about the mismatch between the 30 amps an the 12 gauge?
"Like I said, not our job or responsibility."
IMHO, I think a contractor has a duty to advise homeowners if something is not up to code,
and if it is a safety issue, either refuse to install the appliance (or whatever): or insist on a change order.
Further, i think the statute of limitations on an unsafe, faulty install is NOT limited to "one year",
but 4 years if it is noted: and ten years if a fire or other hazard causes loss because of it.
==================
I've told him what I think:
I've sent references to codes I think apply:
and I've said that I would pay for wire and circuit breakers if needed,
but he needs to get the install corrected to current codes .
I've given him a week to yea or nay,
and then I will go to CSLB and file a complaint,
get a forensic Electician to make repairs and take pictures,
pay for that service,
and commence trying for recovery from the contractor
down the pay-a-lawyer route.
(I've NEVER sued anyone..)
========================
So anyway, if I'm FOS, please advise.
I that a fair offer?
Any other suggestions?
Thanks to my friend Rich, who turned me on to this site.
Regards,
David