Plumbing drain advice need

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum' started by gunit, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. Jan 9, 2013 #1

    gunit

    gunit

    gunit

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    Hello all,
    I think i have a relatively easy question for you experts, I have not done any sort of plumbing like this before, so i wanted to get some advice from you guys who know what you are doing.

    My kitchen sink has gotten plugged a number of times, and to the point where under the sink gets completed flooded with water (i don't what the fitting is called, but it is a smaller 1/2" drain that points upwards above the trap)

    What I think is the problem is that the previous owner plumbed this incorrectly. Where the water leaves the garburator, it is tied in before the trap, and I have had to take it apart a couple of times to drain it. It is so bad that I cannot even use the garburator. Of course, that is my speculation, that is why i am here, i hope someone of you can give me some advice on how to redo this. I have purchased some ABS glue and some parts already, but I want to make absolutely sure before i start cutting things and adding fittings in.

    I have attached a picture for you to look at, in the pictures i have numbered a couple of things so you can understand what i am talking about.

    As you can see, #1 is one drain and #2 is the drain for the garburator. when the water leaves the garburator, it drains to junction #3, which is before the trap. This so happens to be the same drain that #1 uses, which likely explains why when i do alot of washing and the water piles up, it over flows through the one spout that is just between #3 and #1 (pointed up).

    I have no clue what #5 is, nothing is connected to that. #4 i assume is the main pipe that takes the water outside the house to where-ever it goes.

    How do i reconfigure this correctly so i can get everything working properly??? Any advice would be appreciated. I hope the attachment of the JPG works....

    Kitchen Plumbing Problem.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2013
  2. Jan 10, 2013 #2

    CallMeVilla

    CallMeVilla

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    WOW! That is a mess -- even though I suspect it works. The plumbing principle is to minimize the turns and angles so the water can flow evenly. Your garbage disposal makes a lot of turns which slows down the outflow. Not good. Frankly, I NEVER use the disposal -- too much maintenance. You could re-plumb this whole mess by losing the disposal and running straigher pipes . . . but, since you have it . . . <sigh>

    I see the bowl under the p-trap. I guess the leakage is coming from there. Notice the angle in the p-trap as it hits what might be the drain . . . UGH.

    Your #5 might be a vent stack which allows air to enter the lines, preventing a blockage.

    Here is a picture of how it should look. If you can re-design it as cleanly as this, you will solve many problems.

    garbagedisposal.jpg
     
  3. Jan 10, 2013 #3

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    The little spout that you say overflows is for the dishwasher drain and should not be open. In Villa's photo you can see the dishwasher line goes directly into the garberator. Where do pipes 4 and 5 go to up when they go out of site.
     
  4. Jan 10, 2013 #4

    gunit

    gunit

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    Thanks. I assume pipe #4 is the sewage line. I have no clue what pipe #5 is. i assume it's another sewage line, but nothing is visibly connected to this.

    The little spout that points up, which is the spout just to the right and up of #4 is where the water overflows from and drips down - how do i close this? Is this the dishwasher drain that you are referring to??

    So the fix is to repipe this to eliminate as many of the angle pieces as possible??
     
  5. Jan 10, 2013 #5

    gunit

    gunit

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    One other question, if i can reconfigure this, I would eliminate the angle coming out of the garburator, so it would be straight, and I would pipe that to the drain from #1 (going down), do i need the one joint that is above Joint #3? that is the joint with the spout pointing up....

    Then from the P-trap, I would then try to eliminate the one angle piece that runs into the sewage line by making that one piece straight as well.

    Does this sound reasonable? All of the pipe is glued tight, so doing this may take me abit of time to do and reglue. The most urgent spot appears to be the bend coming out of the garburator....
     
  6. Jan 10, 2013 #6

    Wuzzat?

    Wuzzat?

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    Turns out the 2011 NEC is on the Web because once it becomes law it is no longer covered by copyright. I also have an online version of the 2008 NEC.

    Therefore, a current edition of the International Residential Code is probably on the Web somewhere, and I recommend you look for it.

    I had a simple vanity install and had very few options as to piping if I would follow their guidelines if I didn't want to tear up the wall and repipe.
    These codes can be pretty restrictive.

    However, as to testing, for testing a lavatory sink you can fill it to the overflow hole (about a gallon) and yank out the stopper at time = 0. Then, good systems drain in 5 to 15 seconds (sample size = 2) and a bad one (sample size = 1) in 70 seconds. Even if you see a little whirlpool the piping can still be partially restricted.
    For more accuracy/repeatability fill with 1.0 gallon.

    For larger sinks some benchmarks can also be extracted, probably using two or more gallons, with a Disposall running or not.
    Stay tuned to this channel! :D
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2013
  7. Jan 10, 2013 #7

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    You might be able to get a cap to glue on the end of that small pipe if not a short peice of hose with a bolt or something in the other end and clamped would be a temp fix. But it looks like you have a dishwasher line higher up on pipe 4. If it is up there it shouldn't be. Do pipes 4&5 go back into the wall?
     
  8. Jan 11, 2013 #8

    gunit

    gunit

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    The sink is in an island in my kitchen, both appear to go downstairs. I am not really sure what #5 is yet!

    Where should the dishwasher line on Pipe 4 be hooked up to? should I be redoing that as well?
     
  9. Jan 11, 2013 #9

    Wuzzat?

    Wuzzat?

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    Venting for island sinks gets a little weird.
     
  10. Jan 11, 2013 #10

    inspectorD

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    Does number 5 go around in a loop, or is there a vent looking thing at the top or the pipe that ends about at the countertop.
     
  11. Jan 11, 2013 #11

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    I think I have it now , #4 loops into #5 which is the vent. The garberater should have a spot on the side for the dishwasher hose, you will have to knock out the center as it is sealed while not in use.
     
  12. Apr 8, 2013 #12

    gunit

    gunit

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    Ok, after many excuses to delay this project, I decided yesterday just to go an do it. Well, a couple of things I had to do, I had to knock out the plug out of the garburator so I could connect the hose, which meant I had to take the garburator out, which actually was easier than I thought, jus one quick turn to the left and it dropped out. Being that easy to remove, I was abit worried that when I put it back in that I was for sure going to have a leak... I haven't tried it yet, so I hope there isn't.

    so I bought all the pieces as per the recommendation from everyone to minimize the amount of bends. It was not the easiest to get everything square and took abit of grunt force to get everything in place. So I glued the joints that need to be glued and then use the normal screw in joints for the rest of them.

    I opted to go with a ptrap with a cleanout plug.

    So once everything was said and done, I waited an hour for the glue to dry, I put water through it, and found a leak!!!! the leak was coming from the cleanout plug at the bottom of the ptrap. everything was closed by the time I realized this. I am hoping that Teflon tape will do it, but maybe I wasn't suppose to go with this configuration with the cleanout trap??? Anyway, I will post some pictures, any feedback would be appreciated. I hope that I can make this work with the cleanout plug because it will be a chore in itself to redo this whole this with a ptrap without the plug!!!

    New Config Plumbing.jpg
     
  13. Apr 8, 2013 #13

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    The tape should work fine. I wouldn't have used the one with a cleanout as the whole thing can be taken out anyway.
     
  14. Apr 9, 2013 #14

    gunit

    gunit

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    Thanks... if for some reason using Teflon tape doesn't solve it, should I just use plumbers glue on the threads and glue it completely shut? I am dreading have to take everything apart and put it back together with the normal ptrap!
     
  15. Apr 9, 2013 #15

    nealtw

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    I think the tape will do it.
     

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