popping noise

[Tony]

Last july I moved into a house built in 1978. As winter approached I notice that there was a popping noise from ceilng to floor especially in the early mornings. A went online and got some info as the floors started to squeak and I just noticed that the floor joist came loose from the rim joist. An engineer came out and gave no real solution. Whats going on and how can I fix it?

 

[Aceinstaller]

define "came loose"

if it is sitting on the bottom sill plate, you might consider some long screws or possibly a joist hanger from your local hardware store.

need detailed info for detailed advice

 

[oldslowchevy]

seeing how you live in mass i will tell you what is happening as the same thing happen to me when i lived in great barrington your home has a color on it(mine was dark blue)i am just taking a guess at this and as the sun comes up on a cold morning the sun is making your home expanad (nails go POP)and in the eveings if you lisen close you will hear a creak(home is now contracking)most times the nails go both in and out with this but sometimes the nails only go out and have to be hammered back in place.this is only a guess but that does happen though it isn't very common

 

[inspectorD]

Is this a south facing wall with many window's.
What type siding do you have? Is it aluminumn?
Do you have foundation cracks in this area of the joist?
Why didnt the engineer have a clue? Get an engineer who is also a home inspector and you might have a better explination. Someone like that can tie all the systems together.Generally an engineer is only a structural or specific trade engineer.

Do you see any bugs?
InspectorD

 

[Tony]

by came loose, I mean the joists sit is sitting on the sill plate and is roughly 1 inch away from the band board.

 

[Tony]

thanks for the info

 

[Tony]

the wall is west facing, vinyl siding and there is a small foundation crack in the area and there are no bugs.

 

[Aceinstaller]

tony,

take a long close look at the rim joist from the exterior and interior of the home. is it the rim joist moving to the exterior of the home off of its original spot on the sill plate?

or is it from movement or shrinkage of the floor joist pulling the end of the floor joist towards the interior of the home?

If it is the movement of the rim joist. you will probably see a slight buckle in the exterior right at the spot that you are describing. if this is the case, take a siding removal tool, remove the siding in the area effected. then hammer the rim joist back into original position.(you might have to sink some 16 penny nails into the floor joist that it has separated from to pull it back in.) then screw in some angle brackets from the basement to the rim joists and the floor joists along the entire wall that is having problems. replace the siding, and walllaaaahhhh.

take care of the foundation crack with a proffesional that will driil and fill the crack with epoxy resin designed for such occasions.

 

[Square Eye]

by came loose, I mean the joists sit is sitting on the sill plate and is roughly 1 inch away from the band board.

WOW!

I wonder if it was just a bad cut? Some framers will leave a mess that they think you will never find. If the cut is just short, there is no perfect solution. A splice on both sides would help. I wonder if the floor could be expanding enough make the popping noise there. The floor is attached to the rim joist. If the floor joist is close enough to the edge of the green plate, there could be enough movement to cause a noise. The floor joist could be crushing the inside edge of the green plate. OR, the floor joist could be crushing under the load due to the lack of integral support from the rim joist.

You might have a pro to look at it if you can't tell what caused the short joist.

 

[inspectorD]

What kind of heat do you have?
Is there a door in this area?
Do your exterior walls have a slight bow on the outside. You will see this if you look down the wall. Where there are no windows or doors in the way it will show up easier.
Is there any sign of crushing of wood at these areas?
I'm on the same page as SQ Eye, I think if it is only one joist that is short it was installed short.
If a couple of joists are short then this is different.
We need some better descriptions of everything that is going on ,but I think we can at least narrow it down.


InspectorD

 

[K2eoj]

In my area metal/strap wind bracing was popular in the 80's and 90's. These straps will make a popping noise when expanding or contracting. I built a house for myself in the 80's and put lots of extra strap bracing on it and got alot of extra popping noises. In the case of bracing making noise I don't believe there would be any real problems.
In the case of your rim joist it could just be sloppy framing like some of the others have said. K2

 

[Tony]

I see a slight buckleon the outside. I neglected to let you know that there is a deck along the wall where the floor joist is off the rim joist. I had two people look at it and one said to screw through the deck band joist through the rim joist and into the floor joist from the outside. The other said to use and eye bolt and a 5 ton come along to pull the rim joist and floor joist back together and then install joist hangers????

 

[inspectorD]

Sounds like you have a long term problem occuring.
How high off the ground is your deck? How big is it? Does it have joist hangers.HOW MANT JOISTS ARE SHORT?
Is there any decay of wood in this area from the outside? Do you have some metal flashing at the deck and band joist connection?

If your deck is pulling more than one floor joist away from the band joist you WILL need a competent person besides the engineer you had look at it.
If they could not answer this question for you they are not qualified!!

Some engineers drive trains!!

InspectorD

 

[Tony]

I should have told you there is a deck where the joist are short. I put a level on the basement wall in the general area and it out of plumb.

 

[inspectorD]

Hey,, I love the Idea of anything and a 5 ton come along!!
Be careful of just scewing things back together,, that's where screwed up comes from.

Are your deck posts out of plumb?

I know 20 questions!!!!

InspectorD

 

[inspectorD]

Does the foundation have cracks or is there a doorway in the area under the deck, like a patio door?
Again,,,, is there any rot or decay?

 

[Tony]

The floor joist are off the rim joist the width of the deck. However the deck appears to be "propertly built" per the guy who came by.The deck is 15' x 10', it does have joist hangers on the 2' x 10' joist. A carpenter came by and said that thre was no eveidence of rot. he said the deck has no flashing and that there needs to be metal flashing, I asked to have ice and water shield as well. He said he would remove one deck board and a couple of pieces of vinyl siding to installflashing. He also said that whre he could he would he would install joist hangers on the inside. He also said he would lag-bolt the deck in other than the (3) places as it is now. he also noticed that the door leading to the deck has a loose sill so he will replace the door and any rot he should find once he removes the siding.???????

 

[inspectorD]

Without seeing this area, It sounds like rot.
With no flashing at the deck since 1978.The deck is pulling off the house. The nails holding the joists to the band joist are most likely gone.The heads of the nails and the exterior of the wood have probably decayed away.
Looking from the inside you may not notice it that much, but when your carpenter pulls the deck ledger off the house , it may be worse than you originally anticipated.
The good thing about it is you will finally get it done correctly(keep us posted).And no deck collapsed, that was most likely next.

The popping in the winter may have been the deck moving away from the house.From water behind the ledger board, Freeze ...thaw....wieght of snow on deck...wind... any other thoughts?

Let us know what the carpenter thinks is the fiX..

Inspectord

 

[onyx]

Last july I moved into a house built in 1978. As winter approached I notice that there was a popping noise from ceilng to floor especially in the early mornings. A went online and got some info as the floors started to squeak and I just noticed that the floor joist came loose from the rim joist. An engineer came out and gave no real solution. Whats going on and how can I fix it?

I also live in a 'popping' house - although no obvious joist or framing reasons.
A large 1-story built in 1959 - we have been there for 6 years now - and the area above the master bedroom gives loud popping noises -especially late at night (I suspect as the house cools ). I have inspected from roof to crawl-space several times and find no obvious signs of settling or movement. I have been monitoring the plumb of walls and ceiling for the 6 years with no significant changes. I read in another Forum that this noise is normal over time as wood dries and shrinks.

 

[inspectorD]

Sometimes it's nice to find out what the outcome is.....Onyx, do you have a metal roof? They tend to make loud 'gunshots' when they expand or contract with temperature changes.