Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill, joe is close, but the answer is right there in this image; http://imgur.com/HSOxvf2
Replacing 3 way Switch
- Thread starter bjmcgoo22
- Start date
Help Support House Repair Talk:
nealtw
Contractor retired
This should be what he has. Neutral is from some other source.
In the first photo power comes in on the center cable and goes to left switch single acting (outside light) and is jumper to the 3 way switch on the right out of that switch are a white and black traveler that go to the other three way down the hall the other wire off that one goes to a light in hall and on to a common down there.
That’s my take on how it is wired. Left cable outside light right cable travelers and center cable power.
That’s my take on how it is wired. Left cable outside light right cable travelers and center cable power.
afjes_2016
Established Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2016
- Messages
- 766
- Reaction score
- 361
Yes the switch on the right seems to be a switch loop and the switch on the left a regular switch configuration. What are you trying to say Snoonyb?
Still no reason for a 3 ways switch which the original diagram indicates. No cable/romex with 3 conductors.
afjes_2016
Established Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2016
- Messages
- 766
- Reaction score
- 361
Ok it seems i posted after others posted.
Hummm! Still, his picture shows a 3 ways switch ( according to the pic). There must be at least one 3 conductor romex in the box then and I don't see one.
Please, tell me what I am not seeing here then. I am open to suggestions.
Hummm! Still, his picture shows a 3 ways switch ( according to the pic). There must be at least one 3 conductor romex in the box then and I don't see one.
Please, tell me what I am not seeing here then. I am open to suggestions.
nealtw
Contractor retired
In the first sketch post 1 if he put the pig tail (power) to the top screw on the right and puts white and black to the other screws it will work.
afjes_2016
Established Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2016
- Messages
- 766
- Reaction score
- 361
So what you are saying is Bud that maybe someone used 2 2 wire romexes instead of one 3 wire romexes. That is a possibility but unlikely-But still possible.
nealtw
Contractor retired
Ok it seems i posted after others posted.
Hummm! Still, his picture shows a 3 ways switch ( according to the pic). There must be at least one 3 conductor romex in the box then and I don't see one.
Please, tell me what I am not seeing here then. I am open to suggestions.
Long before this was a three way it was a switch leg, with power going to the light. The neutral at the light is still in uses.
When it is set up like that with power at this switch the whole thing can be wired with 2 wire.
I did not say it was right. But if the neutral is at the light there is no need to run a neutral to the switches
afjes_2016
Established Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2016
- Messages
- 766
- Reaction score
- 361
But again according to the first sketch he is replacing a single pole switch with a 3 way which makes no sense (in reality you can use a 3 ways switch in a bind if you don't have a single pole handy).
We still have not heard from the OP anything about the other two switch locations.
nealtw
Contractor retired
No, in the sketch he has labeled the outside light switch as old and the one you are looking for is not depicted.
afjes_2016
Established Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2016
- Messages
- 766
- Reaction score
- 361
Yes that is correct however the common must have either the hot or the load to the light and the other two travelers. Something is just not right here; I am sorry. Until we get better pictures (from all switch box locations) I can't figure this out. Also the OP mentioned 2 other locations that this light is controlled by. Just does not make any sense to me.
You do not need a red wire to make a three way. Power comes from the one cable and the other two wire cable is the travellers. I don't know where the neutral is being picked up at the light but if it worked before it will work again.
nealtw
Contractor retired
Did you see post 22
Here are photos from the other 2 locations.
4 way: http://imgur.com/pjmI2zR
3 way: http://imgur.com/mVKF2Iq
4 way: http://imgur.com/pjmI2zR
3 way: http://imgur.com/mVKF2Iq
What bud said is correct, as is the diagram neal posted, because it has never been a prerequisite the a 12 or 14/3 romex are necessary for a three way switch to operate, just a convenience.
All the op had to do was swap the locations of the travelers, and it would have fixed the problem.
Last edited:
The black wire going from one switch to the other is the common. Put it under the black common screw.
Before you do that you need to fix the issue of two wires under one screw. That is not allowed. Take the power wire and nut two short black pigtails to it. Take the other end of the pigtails and connect to the switches.
JoeD's suggestion worked. The original 3 way was configured differently so the orientation of the screws were set up on different sides. That's what was throwing me off. I moved the jumper to the common and it works just fine. I'll just need to buy a couple pigtails to do the job properly.
Thanks again for all the help.
nealtw
Contractor retired
Congrats; Just buy 1 ft of 14/2 and take the wire out of it.
BTW. you do not have protection from a ground so it would be a good idea to figure out which outlets should be protected and add GFCIs in line.
If you are interested in that start another thread so we can all argue there too.:rofl:
nealtw
Contractor retired
As this is not a common set up that some have not seen before, it is a good idea to have a talk about it so the next time we see it we will all be able to help.:thbup:
I bought the house 3 years ago and after seeing this (the two wires under one screw), it makes me want to pull all my switches and outlets to make sure everything is kosher.
I'll start a new thread on adding GFCIs. Thanks for the suggestion.
It is fairly common in the DIY world and wire is not cheap. I keep a supply of 12-2 and 14-2 around but would never use a roll of 12-3 or 14-3 up in a lifetime. So I would wire it just as shown here minus the double ups under the screws and a few other things like not having a ground. I have always marked the travelers though with red tape.
One thing that drives me nuts I think I saw in some of the pics here is when I see the wire wrapped the wrong way around the screw.
One thing I have done and the pros can tell me if it is to code or not with a jumper like this. If I dont want to use the pigtails and wire nut I just leave the feed wire long and strip it in the middle and make a loop for the screw. Two wires come off one screw but only one thickness of wire. Then I strip the end and make a hook for the next connection.
I first started doing it in barns as a kid where we had a string of porcelain bulb fixtures and instead of cutting the wire a bunch of times and making connections we just stripped the wire without cutting. If you did get some corrosion the rest of the string wasnt affected.
