Replacing switches in bath 4-function exhaust/heater/lights unit

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If you had one gfci you would bring power in on the screw marked line and then you can feed other non gfci outlets from the load screw.
If you have three gfci outlets all wires should be hooked to the line side of all outlets.
Disconnect one at a time until you find the guilty guy.
 
theorbo said:
Hi all, sorry for the delayed response. I've been able to look at the GFCIs, and it appears that they are all connected in series starting with the outlet closest to the corner. I also noticed that the ground wire is disconnected in this initial GFCI. Could that cause the buzzing/rattling noise that I have heard? Thanks for your help.

Now, about that ham sandwich ... :)
Click to expand...

Reconnect the grnd., power the circuit up and start doing voltage tests, line-load.
 
nealtw said:
If you had one gfci you would bring power in on the screw marked line and then you can feed other non gfci outlets from the load screw.
If you have three gfci outlets all wires should be hooked to the line side of all outlets.
Disconnect one at a time until you find the guilty guy.
Click to expand...

These are smart GFCI's and need power to the line terminals or they act as if there is no power, and can't be reset.
 
nealtw said:
Yes and only a non gfci should be in series after a gfci
Click to expand...

But thats not what he has and because these are smart GFCI's they need power to the line on each successive recepticle or they will not register as powered and cannot be reset and remain in the tripped position.

See msg. #97.
 
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Snoonyb said:
But thats not what he has and because these are smart GFCI's they need power to the line on each successive recepticle or they will not register as powered and cannot be reset and remain in the tripped position.

See msg. #97.
Click to expand...

But this why you wire them all to the line as in the picture.

If these are self testing maybe that is what the buss was.
If the are in series and the first one tests then the others trip too.
I don't understand why he has three. One would do the job.
 
Simple to find out if they're strung together; turn off any one and see if the other two go out. Try all combinations. If they are strung together, remove the two 'followers' and replace with standard outlets.
Now, about that buzz; if it is still there when you have removed the excess GFCI's, and you have unplugged the light to be sure it wasn't the cause, you can use one of your 'new spares' to replace the buzzing GFCI.
 
nealtw said:
But this why you wire them all to the line as in the picture.

If these are self testing maybe that is what the buss was.
If the are in series and the first one tests then the others trip too.
I don't understand why he has three. One would do the job.
Click to expand...

Oh, I agree and that may eventually be the cure.

Judging from the jiffy box where the switches were reconfigured, someone has been at work here and appears to have not entirely grasped the concept of GFCI circuitry.
 
theorbo said:
Hi all, sorry for the delayed response. I've been able to look at the GFCIs, and it appears that they are all connected in series starting with the outlet closest to the corner. I also noticed that the ground wire is disconnected in this initial GFCI. Could that cause the buzzing/rattling noise that I have heard? Thanks for your help.

Now, about that ham sandwich ... :)
Click to expand...

OK, communication problems aside. Buy two regular outlets and replace #2 and #3 wire them to the load side of the first one, then everything is protected and install the other two on other circuits in the house.
Now that you paid the extra price you may as well get some good use out of them.
 
theorbo said:
Hi all, sorry for the delayed response. I've been able to look at the GFCIs, and it appears that they are all connected in series starting with the outlet closest to the corner. I also noticed that the ground wire is disconnected in this initial GFCI. Could that cause the buzzing/rattling noise that I have heard? Thanks for your help.

Now, about that ham sandwich ... :)
Click to expand...

If anything they should be connected in parallel. If they are really in series that’s not a good thing at all.

I would take them all out but the first one and reconnect the ground wire.
 
Here's some pics - I want to make sure that I am describing the situation correctly. I think I need to get a pic of what's going on in the corner GFCI's box. What is a "jiffy box"?

WP_20160309_21_02_45_Pro.jpg

WP_20160309_20_58_46_Pro.jpg

WP_20160309_20_59_50_Pro.jpg
 
The two you show are wired in parallel and as they should be. The black and white connection is a parallel jumper. I think there should have also been a jumper to the safety ground also or a pigtail to it as you show.

There is no real need to have two together like that the way I normally do it is put one in the first position attaching power to the line terminals then run from the load terminals to the next regular outlet and then parallel wire as many as I want protected down the line. Any outlet down the line will then trip the first one. There is really nothing wrong with having a bunch of them like that except it wastes money doing that.
 
theorbo said:
Here's some pics - I want to make sure that I am describing the situation correctly. I think I need to get a pic of what's going on in the corner GFCI's box. What is a "jiffy box"?
Click to expand...

Thanks.

A "jiffy box" is the style of box depicted in the switch reconfiguration and the one in the new photos containing the 2 GFCI's.

The wall material is cut the size of the box, the conductors inserted into the box, the assembly inserted into the wall and two clamps are tightened to hold the box against the top and bottom retaining tabs encircling the screw tangs for retaining the device inserted in the box.

I prefer to do a wall patch and use a standard box than fiddle around in a tight, marginal quality installation.

Regarding the 3 duplex recep. you are dealing with; The general method of installation is as Neal described.

OR, if the 2nd duplex GFCI recep. is feed from the load side of the first, to its line side, move the connection from the load side if the first, up to the line side, of the first, at the 2nd, if the 3rd is fed from the load side of the 2nd, move the conductors from the load side of the 2nd up to the line terminals and you will have three independently acting GFCI"S.

Also, keep in mind, GFCI:s wear out.

This is expanding, quickly, to some potato salad, to accompany the ham sanwich.
 
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Thanks for all the explanations and help with this 'simple' project that morphed into much more than I bargained for.

I was finally able to get my GFCIs sorted out today - ultimately the middle outlet was bad and had to be replaced.

Regarding why the previous owners used three separate GFCIs even though they are connected to each other via load to line ... I wonder if it was because by code any outlet in the bathroom had to be on a GFCI and if there was only one GFCI and the other two were traditional 3-prong outlets then the inspector wouldn't be able to know that they were GFCI protected without dismantling the outlets?

In any event - thanks all! This has been a major learning exercise for me. You guys rock!
 
There is really not much sense in guessing why a particular homeowner does a particular thing. But I would venture a guess that he/she just didn't know that one GFCI protected multiple outlets.
 
theorbo said:
I wonder if it was because by code any outlet in the bathroom had to be on a GFCI and if there was only one GFCI and the other two were traditional 3-prong outlets then the inspector wouldn't be able to know that they were GFCI protected without dismantling the outlets?
Click to expand...

Daisy chained, as they were, would fault all three were the 1st too fault and the same would occur were the two slave recep. controlled by the GFCI.

As an inspector, I carried a small GFCI tester, for use when the contractor or homeowner was not present for the inspection, with a plug-in tool or lamp.

Inspectors are not allowed to disassemble an assembly.

theorbo said:
In any event - thanks all! This has been a major learning exercise for me. You guys rock!
Click to expand...

Regarding the aforementioned ham samich and tater salad. would you be so king as to drop them just down from your house, at the corner of WALK/DON'T WALK?
 
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