Idea help to heat/insulate this bathroom !!!

Discussion in 'Insulation and Radiant Barriers' started by Billbill84, Nov 10, 2019.

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  1. Nov 10, 2019 #1

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    IMG_1087.PNG IMG_1088.PNG IMG_1089.PNG IMG_1090.PNG IMG_1091.PNG IMG_1092.PNG Hi guys. Please check out my pics and the blueprint sketch of my house below. I'll provide illustration to help readers understand my setup.
    The problem: cold closet and next to a freezing bathroom that had the tub drain freeze last season. Both areas are constructed above a non-heated but insulated finished garage.
    What I've found: area above garage is semi finished insulated and 3/4" plywood down for storage purposes. It's all plywood and only spot with possible cold draft is at end of rafter tails near soffits so I stuffed a bunch of R30 in two of the tail ends. Still nasty cold and somehow air still wisking in or maybe it's all just due to the way it's constructed but not sure, that's why I'm here lol! Second is design flaw due to design of my HVAC system, more on that later.
    *The first pic is a blueprint of my house, blue is garage and red is area that's built over garage and orange is area in question (cold bathroom and closet)
    *Second is actual pic of area bottom view of closet and bathroom that's built over cold garage.
    *Third is a mock up of how I added insulation in ends of joists that were in line with boxed in area over garage that is cold
    *Next two are pics of outside view behind vinyl siding is the bathroom and closet areas.
    *Finally last pic is of my HVAC system that feeds the second level that has the freezing bathroom. It runs through the 2nd level subfloor. It's generally always cold up there in winter but that fact that the bathroom floor and tub are so cold, actually the whole floor really carpet and all, is cold!! All my supplies and returns are in the ceiling and top of walls with the main floor having them supplies in the floor makes me think my second level subfloor is cold because there's no radiant heat in it. It's not being heated because of the distance between the main floor registers and the second level ceiling registers. The cold subfloor could be a symptom of another issue that's also to blame for the freezing bathroom!
    Why is this bathroom so damn cold that my tub drain froze. The entire subfloor is so cold in winter! Any ideas on how I can fix this drafty second level subfloor! Maybe air leakage from the garage?? I'm confused
     
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  2. Nov 13, 2019 #2

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    Anyone? For what it's worth? I'm thinking about going in the garage attic, I'm wondering if it will make any difference if I put up some of that 2" insulation board over the tyvec and plywood that's actually the exterior walls that seem extremely drafty, but this issue seems as if my entire 2nd floor subfloor is cold (60 degrees) and it gets worse near the areas that protrude out about 3ft over the garage! I don't know what else to do! Are there any companies that measure drafts and pinpoint locations of issues??
     
  3. Nov 13, 2019 #3

    oldognewtrick

    oldognewtrick

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    Contact your local utility provider and ask if they do energy audits.
     
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  4. Nov 13, 2019 #4

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    There is likely a 2 or 3 ply girder truss about 3 to 4 ft high and the rest of that wall is built on top of that .
    More insulation would help but it is tricky to stop all air from getting passed your new insulation and did they leave an opening to get into the little slope going the other way.
     
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  5. Nov 13, 2019 #5

    zannej

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    Would heating the garage somehow help?
    My only thought other than that is to add space heaters (which is not ideal).
    Wish I could be of more help but this one is beyond my area of knowledge.
     
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  6. Nov 13, 2019 #6

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    most times the garage is not insulated and you can't have air movement from garage to house so if the house has hot air, that would not work and furnace would not be big enough.
     
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  7. Nov 14, 2019 #7

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    Ha! I was also wondering about that little slope on the exterior it's very suspicious in this case. There's no entry point to it BUT if I go into that closet that's next to the cold bathroom, the closet has an access panel for the cold tub's plumbing. MAJOR draft activity going on in there on the side of tub that's actually right behind that little roof slope! I can barely see in there from that access panel in that closet maybe only 1" of view. However, I may go on cut out a 4ft by 16" hole from the garage attic side to see if I can get inside there and if so, pack the whole thing full of unfaced R30 or something? Idk I'll send more pics of exactly what I'm talking about. Stay tuned please lol. For now here's a close up of that sloped area
     

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  8. Nov 14, 2019 #8

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    If you have a 3 or 4 inch hole saw I would use that first, if they used a valley set there , you won't get much of a hole

    This what a valley set looks like they will be 24" on center with a 2x4 nailed down just below to stop them from sliding down the roof. If you can find the right spot you may get an 18" hole by the 22 inches between the garage trusses. bil 5.png
     
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  9. Nov 14, 2019 #9

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    Good to know thank you! I will have to post a couple pics of the inside of garage vs that outter valley slope. I think where the inside
    Of garage roof tapers off in the corner, the other side of this corner would be the inside of that slope! If I'm correct on this, how do I go about better insulating it? Can't wait to see how far in there I can get this weekend.
     
  10. Nov 14, 2019 #10

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    There should be a hole near the top anyway for venting but if you can just cut a hole big enough for a camera to start. It might be easier to get in from what looks like the stair case on the other side.
     
  11. Nov 14, 2019 #11

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    Ehh that staircase runs up the center of the house, the problem area is way up in front of house. Imagine you're standing at top of steps, turn left and that's the cold side bathroom and bedroom
     
  12. Nov 14, 2019 #12

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    I figured that. Then you could go up from the garage , but get the camera in there first, if it is stick framed there would be much more room in there.
     
  13. Nov 14, 2019 #13

    Billbill84

    Billbill84

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    How would I go about acquiring one of them cameras? Do they have a small light on them too?
     
  14. Nov 14, 2019 #14

    Gary

    Gary

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    A cheap inspection camera could be made by using a selfie stick, purchased or home made. Set your cell phone on video and get as many angles as you can. Pull it out and see what you captured. repeat as necessary until you spot what your'e looking for. Ahh but make sure the cell phone is securely mounted so you don't loose it in there.
     
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  15. Nov 14, 2019 #15

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    If it is OSB take a hammer up there and make a hole big enough to put your phone in and take a few pictures.
    If you hit it hard enough, it will break, unless you have hit framing.
     
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  16. Nov 15, 2019 #16

    Billbill84

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    Hey guys. So upon submitting this case to a contractor acquaintance of mine he agreed with everything said here but also said he was surprised that no one mentioned the soffit panels on that little slope section of roof that leads up higher right to my problem area. He suggested sealing off them soffits as they are completely useless and aren't venting anything and are there for the cosmetics of the house. Saying air is simply wisking up through them and getting past whatever insulation is in there. Tomorrow I'll grab a 2" holesaw and pop a hole in the garage area but I'm betting I won't be able to see much as insulation will be in the way. Thinking I might just figure out the best way/material to seal up these small soffits.
     

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  17. Nov 15, 2019 #17

    nealtw

    nealtw

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    That would not be anything I would do. It is still a cold zone, won't make any difference. If you study the shapes you will see that non of the venting has access to the area in question.
     
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  18. Nov 16, 2019 #18

    Billbill84

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    True. Here's some better "internal"pics combined with all the others to get a better reference. FYI that temp gun shot a temp of 27 degrees in the drain top and 41 on bottom of tub a couple cold nights ago
     

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  19. Nov 16, 2019 #19

    nealtw

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    I have been looking at it like it was all trusses and you have stick framed. which will make it easier to get in there but it won't be the problem I was thinking, and maybe more insulation would help but maybe you just need more heat in the rooms.
    If the ridge in this picture is like your bathroom wall, you can see that all there is, is a 2x? on the angle and the rafter jacks sit on that.
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Nov 24, 2019 #20

    Billbill84

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    UPDATE: Hey guys. So yesterday I started to dig into this issue again and here's some more pics. That bedroom closet that butts up to the cold shower has a plumbing access panel in the closet next to bathroom. In the right side of the access panel pic is the exterior side and there quite a bit of some crappy looking unfaced brown wool-like insulation. I thought there would be an opening something like a small cove that goes under that sloped roof area but that part of wall is plywood all the way down so I guess that's good. I stuffed insulation back in and realized the cold draft is venting up from UNDER the tub through a hole that the tub drain runs down into. It felt like a fan blowing up so I know the source must be in that direction somewhere. That part is the same part from inside the garage that I circled in the other pic. That box on garage ceiling houses the plumbing drain for that bathroom. Could this be simply because it's over a cold garage? I cannot get inside that box any where so I'm wondering if just installing 2" foam board over that box housing on garage ceiling would help any but I doubt it because the upstairs is naturally colder due to the registers being in the ceiling of the rooms up there and somewhat weak as it is. Still livable though. Anyway, the hole that the tub plumbing does down into (that ceiling box in garage) is way too small to get any insulation into! If no one believes the 2" board over that box will help then my only other option would be to cut box open from in garage and insulate it or maybe even try to run a small 2" metal duct through the wall to under the tub to try and get some heat in there?? And also maybe put some plastic up over the outside soffits that are in front of that area? Hell im lost on this one. I'll get some more pics up soon too.
     

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