Is this wiring dangerous

Discussion in 'Electrical and Wiring' started by MikeIsMad, Feb 27, 2017.

Help Support House Repair Talk by donating using the link above.
  1. Feb 27, 2017 #1

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    1
    This weekend while in the attic replacing my attic ladder, I found something that I thought could be dangerous.
    There is an outlet box for 4 outlets. 3 of these outlets are being used, but 2 actually power other outlets and the 3rd powers my driveway light. It seems these should definitely be hardwired, but I'm not sure if it could just be hardwired and enclosed into a box or if it would cause breaker load issues.

    Thanks in advance for your response.

    IMG_4931.jpg
     
  2. Feb 27, 2017 #2

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    Yup that should be fixed up a little. Post some photos of the other stuff there. May as well look at all the adjustments at the same time.
     
  3. Feb 27, 2017 #3

    Kabris

    Kabris

    Kabris

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2014
    Messages:
    191
    Likes Received:
    42
    Yeah this setup is a bit of a head scratcher. At the very least, the 2 that are feeding other outlets should be hard wired. I also believe receptacles in unfinished areas like attics need to be GFCI protected.
     
  4. Feb 27, 2017 #4

    JoeD

    JoeD

    JoeD

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    276
    Cord cap on NM cable is not permitted.
     
    kok328 likes this.
  5. Feb 27, 2017 #5

    slownsteady

    slownsteady

    slownsteady

    Administrator Staff Member Admin Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2009
    Messages:
    6,567
    Likes Received:
    1,180
    Shouldn't be too hard to fix. If the load is okay now, it won't change by hardwiring. AS long as the wire aren't too short....
     
  6. Feb 27, 2017 #6

    kok328

    kok328

    kok328

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2007
    Messages:
    2,762
    Likes Received:
    250
    Was lookng at this and for the life of me, could not come up with any code violations. Yes it seems wrong but, could really find a show stopper.
    Not sure why they would do this but, one outlet feeding another? Why?
     
    nealtw likes this.
  7. Feb 27, 2017 #7

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    515
    You can hardwire the other outlets, follow and conform to stapling and attachment requirements, but what have you gained, other than another place to plug an extension cord into.

    Other than being stiff and unmanageable, there is nothing wrong with using romex for an extension cord.
     
  8. Feb 27, 2017 #8

    markfothebeast

    markfothebeast

    markfothebeast

    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    2
    Aside from "Code" and legality issues, the safety of this depends on the gauge wire powering this outlet, the amperage of the breaker, and how many amps are drawn.

    If that's 14/2 running to the box I'd definitely do something about it. If it were my home I'd join these wires in a junction box and add an outlet nearby (if needed).

    I've seen some pretty bad wiring jobs and this doesn't appear nearly as bad. I've got a buddy that nearly put a 100 amp sub panel in his garage with 30 amp breakers powered by an existing 14/2 .
     
  9. Feb 27, 2017 #9

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    I still want to see how the other boxes are wired, no telling what this guy was thinking.
     
  10. Feb 27, 2017 #10

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hey guys I'll get up there and snap a few more photos this evening. I was actually hoping to find an outlet up there, so I could connect my sawzall and lamp, but wasn't expecting to see this. My first line of business was to replace this ladder that was barely being hung on. Then I wanted to start cleaning up the attic. We moved I to this house 1 month ago and it appears they used the attic for a dumpster during a remodel.
     
  11. Feb 27, 2017 #11

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    1
    Btw, the may be an indication of what they were thinking. IMG_4929.jpg
     
  12. Feb 27, 2017 #12

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    That box has knock out holes and you can buy some clamps that fit there, a few mar connectors (nuts) and some wire staples.
     
  13. Feb 28, 2017 #13

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    1
    ok, heres a few photos.

    This shows the other side of the truss where the box is currently located. Appears to be plenty of extra wire.

    IMG_4944.jpg

    This one shows one outlet box in the ceiling of the garage.
    IMG_4942.jpg

    And this shows the wire to the driveway light. Disregard the box you see there, that is another outlet that is not connected to these.
    IMG_4943.jpg

    I didn't get a picture of the 3rd wire today, but it doesnt appear to be running to a box, but directly down through the wall, powering a wall outlet.

    So after reading all these posts, it sounds like I am fine connecting these with wire nuts inside the box. Would it be ok to attach inside this same box and leave the outlets?
     
  14. Feb 28, 2017 #14

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    You may want to wait until you have that cleaned up a bit so you can tidy up the wire a little when you can see better where it is going.
    Yes you can leave the outlets there or put a blank lid on it and run another outlet box.
     
  15. Feb 28, 2017 #15

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    515
    Yes you can connect those individual romex in that box, however, it appears you may exceed the max. conductor count allowed for that size of enclosure.

    You'll also need to staple each romex within 9" of the box.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2017
  16. Feb 28, 2017 #16

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    MikeIsMad

    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    1
    Can you please elaborate on your comments of how my roof is framed?
     
  17. Feb 28, 2017 #17

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    They look like trusses to me!!
     
    CharlieO likes this.
  18. Feb 28, 2017 #18

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    515
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2017
  19. Feb 28, 2017 #19

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Snoonyb

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    515
    They may be, there is just a lot of debris.
     
  20. Feb 28, 2017 #20

    nealtw

    nealtw

    nealtw

    Contractor retired

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2010
    Messages:
    23,949
    Likes Received:
    3,135
    Something like this

    451326237_1280x720.jpg
     

Share This Page