Improper plumbing & trying to remodel bathroom/laundry

[slownsteady]

Z: are you sure that the drawer goes all the way to the back of the vanity? I would think the Mfr. left room for the plumbing.

 

[frodo]

Z: are you sure that the drawer goes all the way to the back of the vanity? I would think the Mfr. left room for the plumbing.

hA HA HA HA.. I have never seen a manufacture leave room for plumbing
they think that stuff gets hooked up by magic.

sometimes i get so mad, i want to take the cabinet into the designers office and stuff them in to it!!!!

they put a shelf under the sink!!! wtf???? hello!!! PTRAP????

 

[zannej]

Thanks Frodo. I'm going to find images of all of the stuff you listed and put it in an image and label it. Pictures help me remember things better for some reason. LOL.

Thanks to the link to the coveralls, Neil. And I'm pretty sure the drawer goes all the way to the back.

Someone on one of the related forums told me a joke that applies to cabinets and plumbing. Here is the gist of it:
Q: Why are cabinets raised off the ground and hard to get in to?
A: The cabinet maker caught the plumber with his wife.

I can't tell you how annoyed I was with the center piece of wood in the middle of the opening under my kitchen sink. It made it too narrow for me to squeeze in comfortably to one side and when I had to reach on either side of it, it blocked my view and got in the way of my head.

This sort of laundry box?
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0039Z4FSQ/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

I see different ones. I think the water pipes coming up are CPVC (cold water may be PVC, which I know is not to code). The faucets for the laundry room look metal though.

 

[frodo]

when you install the faucets in the new oatey washing machune box
do not have the valves looking straight out. turn then twards the middle on a 45 degree angle.

it makes hooking up the hoses, a lot easier, and your knuckles do not get skinned turning on the valve :beer:

 

[zannej]

For the valves, I was looking at http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JV4VGY/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
and http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JV5X34/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

They only require a quarter turn for on and off.

I just need to figure out what sort of pipes I need to hook them to. I don't think PVC would cut it in this case. I do wonder if the flexible lines like the ones used for toilets would work..

 

[nealtw]

I would do all new piping with pex.

 

[zannej]

I would do all new piping with pex.

I was considering that but there are a couple of issues.
1. There are a LOT of critters around and I've heard that mice, rats, and even bugs sometimes chew through PEX. Since the house is old and not sealed up properly underneath, I'm concerned about mice chewing.
2. I don't know if my plumber has ever used PEX or if he'd be able to install it properly without messing something up. I've heard that things can go wrong if stuff isn't crimped just right-- hell, I don't know if he even has the tools.

Granted, I know that rats could chew through PVC if they really wanted, but thus far they have left it alone. Plus I tend to have extraordinarily bad luck with things, so with my luck, the mice would decide to chew it and there would be a huge leak. We don't use rat poison because last time we did, one of the mice that ate it got eaten by one of our cats and the cat died.

I guess a third issue might be the price. I've heard it can be expensive. If I thought that I could properly do it myself, I would, but I don't want to risk leaks in the walls if I screw up. I've heard the tools to attach the fittings are expensive.

 

[frodo]

i used copper in my walls, and plastic under the house
when i plumbed it, I sweated an adapter on the pipe before i shoved it thru the floor
then hooked up all from under neith. 3/4 copper to all fixtures, stubbed out with 1/2

1" from the meter to the heater

if your plumber is not familar with pex. find another plumber

 

[zannej]

i used copper in my walls, and plastic under the house
when i plumbed it, I sweated an adapter on the pipe before i shoved it thru the floor
then hooked up all from under neith. 3/4 copper to all fixtures, stubbed out with 1/2

1" from the meter to the heater

if your plumber is not familar with pex. find another plumber

Oh, I wish I could just easily get a different plumber out here. My problem is there are only 2 licensed residential plumbers in my area and I don't know if either one of them knows about PEX. The one I use works on DWV systems but I've been told that he doesn't sweat pipes. He's the son of my late plumber. The other guy charges $20 more per hour than my current guy. I've been told he sweats pipes and will do water supply stuff but that he won't touch DWV stuff. My friend hired him for some work and the guy basically came out and told him what parts to buy and how to hook everything up, charged a high fee, and left. The DWV guy shops at the less expensive local hardware store with the nicer employees. The other guy shops at the more expensive place with the rude employees (with the owner who gave me stinkeye for pointing out that its a code violation to use a sanitary tee in a horizontal position). I'm in sort of a No Man's Land for services and people have to be sent from other states to do things sometimes.

Another issue is that I live out in the woods on an unpaved road. People get lost and also some are just afraid to come out here. They expect to hear banjos. You have no idea how many times I've had people decline to come out because its "too far".

I know the water supply lines I want to use for the washer are already plastic (I think CPVC-- I hope CPVC and not PVC). I'm wondering if I can just come up from the floor a bit with some more CPVC and slap on an adapter to have one of those flexible hoses in braided steel..

Like this http://www.homedepot.com/p/Unbrande...eel-Washing-Machine-Supply-Line-W48/202257713

Also, if I get the 1/4" turn shutoffs, do you think I still need to turn them slightly to avoid problems?

 

[frodo]

look, pex is so simple a monkey can do it. if your not comfortable with that then buy cpvc pipe and cpvc glue
a whole lot cheaper than the flex hoses[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVvKxlYcYuo#t=42"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVvKxlYcYuo#t=42[/ame]

as far s the washer box valves. slightly tilted in will make then easier to screw the hoses on

 

[nealtw]

Then you might want to look at shark bite fitting, even the monkeys dumb uncle can handle them and they can be taken apart to correct mistakes.
http://www.sharkbite.com/product-category/push-fit/

 

[zannej]

Ok. Thanks, guys. I appreciate it. I'll have to see if my local hardware store carries any of that stuff. If not I'll have to check one of the big box stores.

I guess there have been improvements to PEX because when I researched it a few years ago, people complained about problems with getting things crimped properly.

 

[nealtw]

Beforepex there was another pipe like it and people had trouble joining the two, and what they missed was that there is a special fitting for doing that. I would go for pex even if I had to buy the crimper for the guy, he would offer to buy it when he is done. Shark bite is fool proof but more expensive.

 

[slownsteady]

Will you be working with a plumber or a handyman? I would think a plumber has his own gear and also his preferences for what materials he works with. For all we know, he could swear by copper.
You might be better off picking your hire by asking him how he would do it. And if you disagree, hire someone else.
One other thought: pex is supposed to be very DIY friendly.

 

[zannej]

Thanks for that info, neil.

slownsteady, I think I'm going to do a little of both. I have a friend who is pretty handy. I have some knowledge on how to do things, unfortunately my physical skills do not match what is in my head. I also plan to ask my plumber some questions and see how much he would charge to do things. I am still hoping to do as much as I can by myself --like taking down the wall panels, taking out old fixtures, removing old floor, installing subfloor, installing moisture barrier, installing vanity, installing vinyl sheet (which I've done before), and installing the toilet (also something I've done before). I may need help with any heavy lifting, so that is where my friend comes in. I've put up wall panels before, and I can do painting if any is needed.

I was going to say I would ask my brother for help, but he's even worse at DIY stuff than I am. LOL. Although, he might be ok at some demo just from his sheer weight. I'll have him lean on stuff. He already put a big hole in one of the walls accidentally.

In terms of progress, I talked it over with my mother and she already bought the Oatey washer box and the valves. She said that we should do the work in spring when it won't be too hot or too cold. It's the first time she's actually semi-committed to a timeline. There's a surplus store that should have sheet vinyl-- since it is a rectangular room, it will hopefully be easier than doing the floor in my bathroom.

The thing I'm most concerned about is getting the tub/shower installed properly. So I'll have to do a lot of research on that.

I'm just babbling away... and my cats have captured a rat....

 

[frodo]

do you know what type of tub?
to install a tub, you need to putt a ledger board across the back wall, the board needs to be treated wood. with this board installed, the tub will not rock
it needs to be 4" shorter than the tub hole on each end. because of the brace on the tub itself
see attached scribbling

 

[frodo]

you will need to make a cutout in the floor for the drain hook up

typical tub cut out. is 14 1/2" from the wall to center of the cut out
cut out is 6"x 12"

 

[nealtw]

I think you can do it.
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3TTfPPVg5k[/ame]

 

[frodo]

I like that tutorial, one of the best I have seen on sweating copper.
couple of things he missed.
after you sand your fitting and pipe end . do not touch it as he was doing. your fingers have oil on them, they will contaminate the pipe

another thing. he said to file the outside of the pipe.after cutting.
if he had not cut the pipe in such a hurry, or tightened the cutters to much , it would not have beveled, and filing would not be necessary. slow down, cut slow, the first time you go around the pipe. go both ways to establish a "score"
then your cutter wheel will not walk


he also did not wipe his joint after solidering

 

[slownsteady]

good points Frodo. It was the same comments i would have made. I had to smile at the sight of his finished sweat; most plumbers would have laughed, I think. I guess he is more of a video professional than a trades guy.

Wiping the joint with a wet (very damp) rag immediately after soldering cleans up the joint and creates a good, smooth seal.