Tesla Achilles Heel
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Worse mileage, harder on engines, puts more land under cultivation, leading to more soil loss, fertilizer use, more mono-crop agriculture. It's a win/win/win/win/win!
I spent a lot of time working with the ethanol industry. They were directly subsidized at one point primarily while they were developing. There are still some subsidies for research into using biomass other than food grains. Stuff like crop waste, wood processing waste (sawdust and the like), different grasses. None of it has ever been particularly successful commercially. The yields are still too low. Now there aren't much government subsidies directly to the ethanol produces but the corn mafia successfully lobbied, I think the Bush II administration, to pass the Renewable Fuel Standards act. The act mandates that the refining industry purchase a specified number of gallons each year. The holy grail, guaranteed market. I don't have any issue with the industry I just think it should stand on it's own. What if the government came out and said if you have more than 1 car 1 of then must be an EV? Oh, I should be careful, don't want to give them any ideas.
Spicoli43
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I was going to buy a Husqvarna riding mower until I read the warranty, which DOESN'T cover the Engine or Transmission! So I did research on Ariens, and the Engine is covered but it says in Bold Black... "Use of gasoline blends exceeding 10% ethanol voids any and all warranties."
Everything else besides tampering with the hour meter is in regular type.
Everything else besides tampering with the hour meter is in regular type.
BvilleBound
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If you or other readers are concerned about government subsidies funded by US taxpayers, you should start with the Big Oil industry -- with receives more than $20 billion every year in corporate welfare. Yep, the same Big Oil industry that is wildly profitable due to high prices imposed on the backs of consumers. See:
Taxpayer funded 'incentives' for the Big Oil industry:
www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/what-tax-incentives-encourage-energy-production-fossil-fuels
www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-fossil-fuel-subsidies-a-closer-look-at-tax-breaks-and-societal-costs
www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2018/jul/30/america-spends-over-20bn-per-year-on-fossil-fuel-subsidies-abolish-them
Big Oil enjoys record profits:
Exclusive: oil companies’ profits soared to $174bn this year as US gas prices rose
Facts give lie to claim record oil money is being poured into green projects
Exxon posts biggest profit in seven years on high oil prices
Subscribe to read | Financial Times
Eddie_T
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So I suppose you are implying that two wrongs make a right? Subsidies (if any) should not be controlled by politicians who in reality only seek to subsidize themselves. We as a nation of sheeple keep them at the trough.
You are entitled to your opinion of course, but such information is misleading. I recommend that you start asking what they are not telling you.They are not telling you that what you are calling "welfare" is just standard tax policy that every other US company gets to take advantage of, including pharma and tech for example. Hence, the so called subsidies are just tax policy. If we want to change tax policy in a way that perhaps makes it more equitable, that would be a good discussion, but singling out a particular industry because someone doesn't like it is tantamount to a making gambling bet on winners and losers with tax payer's money.
Then there is the fact that everyone loves to bash oil and gas companies on the years when gas prices are high. I get it because I feel it to... On the other hand, it is important to realize that US oil and gas companies are "price takers", meaning they simply deal with whatever the market is paying for oil. (If you want to blame the price setters, the primary players are those in OPEC.) Right now the profits of US oil and gas are high, but two years ago they were losing money. That is why there average profit margins often barely break above single digits. The pharmaceutical and tech companies have profit margins well above 20%, and sometimes 30%, and yet I don't see the same kind of disdain. Why?
Spicoli43
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I thinks it's absurd to blame the oil industry for making a ton of money because oil prices are really high. As mentioned they don't set the price. As everyone knows the president sets the price so it's his fault.
Obama ended the Keystone pipeline because it isn't "climate friendly" when it doesn't have any emissions compared to trains and trucks. He then ended drilling, which drove the prices that we now see. We were energy independent between Obama's 2nd and 3rd term. The cutest thing is Obama blames the prices on Putin!
I like your sarcasm...I thinks it's absurd to blame the oil industry for making a ton of money because oil prices are really high. As mentioned they don't set the price. As everyone knows the president sets the price so it's his fault.
It is important to note that I've focused on publicly traded oil and gas (O&G) companies, because national oil companies are another matter. I remember seeing a graph several years ago that the large traded O&G companies (e.g., Shell, BP, Exxon) amounted to only 6% of the world's oil production. Even if that's quite a bit larger now, they are still a small minority. If you think that they set the price, you need to read a bit more on the economics of the O&G business.
I totally understand people's feelings and their desire to blame the O&G companies. At the same time, if you were selling something and someone gave you more money for it, are you going to say "oh, I know that people are hurting so I'm going to charge you less". After all, it is not like there is any guarantee that the next company in the process is going to pass those savings along. Remember that the oil producing companies, refining companies, and independently-owned gas stations are all separate companies.
For what's worth, I was only trying to make people realize that it is not a black-and-white matter as people usually want to believe in. Just a short while ago, some people wanted to get rid of O&G companies and now they are so angry at their dependence... You know, now there are these videos on things to do to lower one's gas usage, etc, and I've realized that I've been doing all of those for years. Whatever the future holds, gas cars, EVs, or something else, I'm fine either way. Just don't ask me to pay for the wants/desires/wishful thinking of other's or to be responsible for the consequences of their choices.
Eddie_T
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Is green really clean?
Is ‘green’ really clean? | Sharyl Attkisson
Is ‘green’ really clean? | Sharyl Attkisson
She seems to just state the obvious. There are not many people who think that any of the green energy sources are 100% clean or free of carbon emissions. We had some discussion after Easter dinner about EVs. One person wanted to go on about how the grid can't possibly handle all the EVs if everyone is using them. It always irritates me when people try to talk in absolutes. EVs are gradually entering the mainstream. Not everyone is going to buy an EV all of a sudden. The grid will evolve as the needs change. It has to this point anyway. 50 years ago most people didn't have ac in their home and if they all went out and installed ac at once the grid wouldn't have been able to handle that either, but here we are with almost every home with ac. I bet back in the early 20th century a lot people thought the automobile was a stupid idea that nobody would ever need. Who in the world needs to go 30 mph? It's way too dangerous! There were very few gas stations or people to work on them. If you wanted to drive further than a tank of gas would take you, you had to plan your route very carefully to make sure you could get fuel. Sound familiar? Yet somehow it all worked out. In my mind so many of the arguements assume a static world. So they throw up their arms and say it will never work, it's a stupid idea. If that's what we did in this country we would still be riding horses and reading by candlelight. JMHO
I agree with all you wrote. We have always been an evolving group of people in this country and the majority of the advancements you mentioned and many more came out of this country under capitalism. People saw a need for a better way. They saw that need as a pathway to becoming rich and people worked for them to also share in the wealth allowing them to own the things they made and invented.
My fear is not running out of fuel as much as running out of the system that allowed this all to happen. I fear the people at the top of the pyramid now don’t have that will to do these things any longer at least a lot of them don’t.
Spicoli43
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Ok, what happens when people get to a fast charger that fills their car to about 80% in under an hour? Well, if you're there alone, great. If all 5 stations are taken up, do you go around and ask people how long they have been there, or just park behind one of them and wait? What do you do for those 50 or so minutes waiting, then your 50 minutes of charging?
Lets make this real fun. Lets add 3 screaming kids per vehicle, so 30 total between 5 charging and 5 waiting. Now, that absolute nightmare might never happen, but can you get to the next charger if it does? Are you stuck there?
When it takes 5 minutes or so to top off an EV like it does an average car or truck, then I'll listen to the arguments for the multitudes of other problems EV tech has.
Lets make this real fun. Lets add 3 screaming kids per vehicle, so 30 total between 5 charging and 5 waiting. Now, that absolute nightmare might never happen, but can you get to the next charger if it does? Are you stuck there?
When it takes 5 minutes or so to top off an EV like it does an average car or truck, then I'll listen to the arguments for the multitudes of other problems EV tech has.
I remember in the late 70's driving to the Florida Keys for vacation. There was a gas shortage and stations all had long lines and all closed early when they ran out. We spent the night in the car at a gas station in an iffy part of Miami because we were out of gas. And that was with a 60+ year old, fully developed system of vehicles and fuel stations. So you could face the same situation with gas too if imports were suddenly cut off. So maybe in say 40-50 years of maturing the system might actually be better. Who knows? I just know we don't import electricity from our enemies.
Fair enough. Now picture the country as it is now with all gas powered cars and everyone has a gas pump at home they use for filling their cars for all trips say of 150 miles or less. The only time you go to the gas station would be when you are taking a trip and not near your home. All the local mini-marts will be a thing of the past for gas. They will lose that income stream so they may or may not be able to hang on selling loto tickets and coffee. No one will willingly want to buy power away from the home for their cars as it will cost much more. If Grandma lives 100 miles from you then when you get to her house you will say mind if I charge my car before we leave and you will plug into her fuel pump.
The real place charging will be done away from the home will be people doing long road trips. What percentage of say the average persons usage is that is the question.
Now you have to take a look at the intermediate steps along the way. maybe the most critical will be 50/50 as I see it as a tipping point most haven’t thought about. Lets say there are 50% of the population that maybe most of us fall into that will be able to switch over to a filling station at home and even afford an EV without much pain. Now you have the people being left behind and the gasoline infrastructure trying to run on half the consumption The corner convenience stores will become the blacksmiths and the buggy whip companies of the future. I’m sure there were a point when the horse people started hurting and the hay growers were wondering what to do as well when autos replaced horses.
Change is never easy.
As a side note 18 months ago we didn’t have to buy any fuel from our enemies.
I posted this a few pages ago.
Here is a decent article and associated video on whether or not the grid can handle EVs. Jason has a number of good engineering videos out there. He has a pretty good one on the problems with towing with an EV. Towing is one area where EVs just don't cut it today.
Engineering Explained: Yes, The Grid Can Handle EVs - CleanTechnica
Eddie_T
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Collectively everyone seems sure the system will evolve as things have in the past. However this time they are betting on batteries. All we need is weightless or small batteries. Although Elon Musk is doing better than NASA in space he still relies on others for battery technology. Unless someone discovers a lightweight fast charging or easily replaceable battery it ain't gunna work. At the present people grumble over the lines at gas stations. I saw lines the last time I was out just because one station has gas priced 2¢ less than one up the street. We need reporters such as Sharyl to remind us of the obvious that we want to ignore.
Charging is never going to be as fast as filling a gas tank and neither is exchanging batteries. The bottleneck is going to be the charging stations unless everyone can charge at home. The thieves stealing catalytic converters now will move on to stealing charging cables. Meanwhile the affluent will charge in the privacy of their garages.
Charging is never going to be as fast as filling a gas tank and neither is exchanging batteries. The bottleneck is going to be the charging stations unless everyone can charge at home. The thieves stealing catalytic converters now will move on to stealing charging cables. Meanwhile the affluent will charge in the privacy of their garages.
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